Has anyone ever re-clocked there TPS and seen any horsepower gains out a 2.2. I know most cars see horsepower with this mod but i figured i check before i go drilling my TPS.
Red 2.8
I am seeing both sides of this.
On one hand if you plugged a scanner in and you pushed the pedal down it will give you a percentage of what your throttle position is. The votlage reading doesnt matter at this point, becuase 100% is 100%.
On the other hand the voltage is where it is getting its reading, and it has a general range. Something like .5 to 5 volts. But most TPS read less than the 5 volts at WOT to achieve the 100%. By adding the 1% the computer now has to adjust for more voltage than what it was previously getting.
I dunno..I am just kinda reading into both sides...
Ive heard of it before, but never really paid that much attention to it. Mostly because I felt like on my truck I had 100% WOT when I put my scanner on it.
On one hand if you plugged a scanner in and you pushed the pedal down it will give you a percentage of what your throttle position is. The votlage reading doesnt matter at this point, becuase 100% is 100%.
On the other hand the voltage is where it is getting its reading, and it has a general range. Something like .5 to 5 volts. But most TPS read less than the 5 volts at WOT to achieve the 100%. By adding the 1% the computer now has to adjust for more voltage than what it was previously getting.
I dunno..I am just kinda reading into both sides...
Ive heard of it before, but never really paid that much attention to it. Mostly because I felt like on my truck I had 100% WOT when I put my scanner on it.
OK, your suppose to have a base reading for idle between lets say 1.0-1.4 volts for the ECM to understand your in idle. At WOT it must see 4.5 min in order to give you the max tune it can for both timing and fuel, but nothing over 4.8 volts since it must stay under the 5 volt reference input.
These TPS's are so generically made and incorrect you will find out after some testing that they can go below the 1.0 voltage min which the ECM unless its under by over 10% allows. On WOT I've seen times where 4.3-4.4 is the max it sees with the plate all the way open. Now in WOT which is anywhere from 75% to 100% open it grabs the tables for tune based off the voltage and disregards most of the sensor inputs at that point. It will not go to the full max tune table with a under 4.5 voltage reading, it doesnt know youve asked for it all no matter what.
Now on the V-8s of the Fbody types you'll find that their TPS' are adjustable so they can nail it completely to full max idle which in turn give them full WOT. Take the same appraoch to any other motor, it works, but only if it doesnt see 4.5-4.55 volts at WOT. You merely elongate the holes of the TPS to advance it. Take a reading with the key on for idle and WOT positions and adjust it just under what the bookcalls for for idle and then see where it lies WOT.
Caspers TPS-TEC addon and the $200 Module thing, forget the name of it, work off pretty much the same style premises. The Casper unit adds 5% to the signal for the entire RPM range till it see 4.2 volts then ups the signal to 4.7 at really 4.2. The other module plug in deal adds 10% to the signal until 4.2 volts then backs out and lets the true TPS reading take over!
These TPS's are so generically made and incorrect you will find out after some testing that they can go below the 1.0 voltage min which the ECM unless its under by over 10% allows. On WOT I've seen times where 4.3-4.4 is the max it sees with the plate all the way open. Now in WOT which is anywhere from 75% to 100% open it grabs the tables for tune based off the voltage and disregards most of the sensor inputs at that point. It will not go to the full max tune table with a under 4.5 voltage reading, it doesnt know youve asked for it all no matter what.
Now on the V-8s of the Fbody types you'll find that their TPS' are adjustable so they can nail it completely to full max idle which in turn give them full WOT. Take the same appraoch to any other motor, it works, but only if it doesnt see 4.5-4.55 volts at WOT. You merely elongate the holes of the TPS to advance it. Take a reading with the key on for idle and WOT positions and adjust it just under what the bookcalls for for idle and then see where it lies WOT.
Caspers TPS-TEC addon and the $200 Module thing, forget the name of it, work off pretty much the same style premises. The Casper unit adds 5% to the signal for the entire RPM range till it see 4.2 volts then ups the signal to 4.7 at really 4.2. The other module plug in deal adds 10% to the signal until 4.2 volts then backs out and lets the true TPS reading take over!
Chiltons or a Hayne manual will give you the details of what its readings should be for WOT and idle along with what color wires to probe to test the TPS out. This test also can prove a TPS as being good or bad whch you hear people at times say they feel a lag at X RPM. As you do the reference test for going from idle to WOT, do it slowly. As you slowly open the plate the reading should always be increasing by at least .1 volts and if you see and area that you open it and no voltage response you have a lazy TPS sensor!
so as i said there is no actual gain in hp. if anyhting you are regaining lost power do to a faulty tps sensor. if you have a low sensor output and you either boost the signal ie caspers you can regain your lost power or by "clocking" the tps you are making the tps out put the correct signal. i think it would be much better to just clean your darn tps. or for that matter just replace it so it functions properly. as stated by 964pt3 anyhting over 4.5v is going to give you a WOT signal. and this guiy had under the 4.5v threshold. so he gained a minimal hp because it was not far off. its just like replacing bad spark plugs or giving the old ones a quick squirt. you not really gaining hp your only getting back what you were missing from a bad part.
There is nothing wrong with my Tps. My truck has nothing but 17,000 miles on it and it very babied. You will never understand unless you know how to work with fuel and ignition maps. I guess i can say that i am not making more horsepower but retreiving horspower and torque that is already there however the computer never made use of. I dont really need to prove anyting to anyone on the forum. If you want to believe do so if you dont too bad. I know thsi work becuase i've been able to look into my fuel maps with a Gm tech 2. A tool that most people dont hhave readily available to them , however becuase i were i go to school i have both a dyno and the Oem scanner available basically anytime i need either one. Learn exactly how a tps work and learn about igniton and fuel maps and them you will understand.gutlesswonder said:
What school do you goto? What are you getting your degree in?
Here is where Im going, and the classes I have to take....Just 4 left till im done!!!!
http://www.unoh.edu/academics/collegetechnologies/degrees/index.php?curriculum=35
Here is where Im going, and the classes I have to take....Just 4 left till im done!!!!
http://www.unoh.edu/academics/collegetechnologies/degrees/index.php?curriculum=35
I felt a un-nerving presence in the force and just had to respond.importmaster1300 said:
"""He gets it. its all about fuel and igniton tables that are in the Ecm but are never accesed becuase the Ecm is not receiving enough voltage to do so.""
I found this a few years back and shared it with the S boards on how to get what you never would ever see back again. The amount of posts about 2 vehicles of the same weight, gears, tires etc but one is noticably slower than the other can usually be attributed to this. 80% of the area S10's I help kids out with including the 3 Ive own never saw over 4.5 at WOT. The tables timing is maxed at 4.5-4.55 volts but fuel tables continue to 4.63!
If anyone ever took off a TPS you would see it has and overtravel that allows it to run past 90 degrees open, more like 110. DO a resistane and ohm test and you see that it works all the way to the 110 open.
I am not trying to argue with you but i do understand how fuel maps work. but there is a bottom line here. the bottom line is your truck has those maps in the comp and your not able to acess those maps because your tps is not outputting the correct signal strength. what your doing is giving the tps a better connection allowing a higher signal to be transmitted to the comp. you say you dont have any faulty parts although you were not getting the correct signal strength you should be. i have tested mine before to make sure i was reaching WOT and guess what i was so not every truck will be the same. 1 truck may not reach WOT when another truck will right off the factory floor. i am in the process of fabricating my own turbo system for this little beast as we speak. if i did not understand "how things work' i wouldnt be doing this. but in all reality thnk about it its just like changing your plugs. if your truck was slow because plugs werent putting out the correct spark and you replace them you didnt gain power you got back what you were missing in the first place. my truck is not missing that. i have run faster times n/a then probably every person on this board. not a single person has posted any times slips or proof to run faster than a 17.3 n/a. i have raced members with better or sinilar mods to mine and still took them by over a second. so if you do these tests and see your not getting 100% throttle then this is a good mod but if you are reaching WOT then there is no need to do this mod. over all i guess if i didnt already achieve WOT then id try it that is for sureRed 2.8 said:
hypathetical question.
If you had 4.4volts at the TPS
and plugged in a scanner to read the percentage, would it read 99 or 100%
What happens after the 4.5? What if it does reach 5 or more volts?
And since the TPS is just a potentiometer, what is the input voltage that crosses the TPS?
Is this input voltage to the TPS the same for every vehicle?
If you had 4.4volts at the TPS
and plugged in a scanner to read the percentage, would it read 99 or 100%
What happens after the 4.5? What if it does reach 5 or more volts?
And since the TPS is just a potentiometer, what is the input voltage that crosses the TPS?
Is this input voltage to the TPS the same for every vehicle?
so then there is no harm in allowing it to reach the full 5 volts.....although the computer reads it as 100% at 4.6. But there is also no gain if you already have 4.6 or more.
So then the thread should have a different title maybe??
something like, "TPS voltage check".... "check your TPS voltage"
Not a mod, but a check. Since your not actually modifying anything, your adjusting something to read with in the highest parameters.
The second thing that I am gathering is that with the IMPORT that you were talking about, the TPS was not set up correctly on MOST of them that you were talking about so it was benificial to check and adjust it to the correct reading.
Moreover, since you had found that your truck was not reading the 4.6 or more you thought it would have the same result; most s-10's would not be set up correctly and we should check them. But, instead you found that most, that have checked theirs, is reading properly.
Please do point out any errors... because I am kind of loosing focus on the origional thread ....
So then the thread should have a different title maybe??
something like, "TPS voltage check".... "check your TPS voltage"
Not a mod, but a check. Since your not actually modifying anything, your adjusting something to read with in the highest parameters.
The second thing that I am gathering is that with the IMPORT that you were talking about, the TPS was not set up correctly on MOST of them that you were talking about so it was benificial to check and adjust it to the correct reading.
Moreover, since you had found that your truck was not reading the 4.6 or more you thought it would have the same result; most s-10's would not be set up correctly and we should check them. But, instead you found that most, that have checked theirs, is reading properly.
Please do point out any errors... because I am kind of loosing focus on the origional thread ....
I have already corrected my self above. Manufactures do limit vehicles from factory. I check this on several vehicles including a 04 GTO and 00 SS that belong to our hot rod program in school and the TPS was set back on both I will be clocking them tomorrow to see if there are any benefits. As far as other vehicles other than my S10 that i have done this to, i've gain horsepower on all of them. one being the Mazdaspeed miata the other being an Mx6 and the third being my s10. I really dont understand why everyone is making a big deal about this. Its free horsepower. It you dont believe it then dont and move on for the people that are interested in seeing if it helps them please PM me. I dont plan on answering any more question becuase this thread has become nothing but a big whore.
im not trying to be an ass.... just trying to understand the situation
I know my computer reads 100% because the scanners that I have used told me that it was at 100%.
I am sure that I have read the voltage, but never really paid any attention to it, because it was reading 100%
But now I am being told that it's not 100% unless it is 4.7 or more volts, and factory vehicles dont read 4.7 volts or more.
Right now I dont have time to go out and check my TPS voltage, maybe another week or two.
I know my computer reads 100% because the scanners that I have used told me that it was at 100%.
I am sure that I have read the voltage, but never really paid any attention to it, because it was reading 100%
But now I am being told that it's not 100% unless it is 4.7 or more volts, and factory vehicles dont read 4.7 volts or more.
Right now I dont have time to go out and check my TPS voltage, maybe another week or two.
It has to read 4.5-4.55 Volts for the ECM to use 100% open throttle timing table. Fuel wont be 100% until over 4.6 volts. It cant read over 4.8 or the ecm will think that theres a short and will code for a TPS performance fault. 5 is the reference voltage given to the TPS and it CANT according to ECM programming be a value off the output side on the TPS, 4.8 is gievn as max anything over is a fault.
want better hp??? buy new TPS, over time sensors gits dirty/clogged, less reading thus the voltages reistance goes higher and less voltages. buyin new sensor would be able bring loss HP back(barely), turnin the TPS would only git fuel lil more richer as if you bought it new, but any further would cause too rich in fuel, I would sugguest buyin new TPS if anyone is worried 1/4hp and 1/2tq back.....do real mods, efan, 56mmTB junkyard mod are much worth the cheap mods for the power gain.....I have tested out the voltage, and honestly as long the sensor is working ok, then its somethn not to worry about, unless sensor is failing which providing less voltage is somethn to replace, then new sensor makes the truck to run much better... make sense???
so am I to understand you must adjust your tps for max output of 5 volts? 86 2.8 s10 4.3 L throttle body
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
-
?
