Engine wire harness Ground - S-10 Forum
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post #1 of 42 Old 05-18-2019, 04:21 PM Thread Starter
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Engine wire harness Ground

Hi I just purchased a 2001 S10 2.2L. The check engine light is on, so I put the scan tool on it, and these are the codes that came up:
P0420 (Catalyst System Low Efficiency (Bank 1)
P0440 Evaporative Emission System
P0452 Evaporative Emission System Pressure Sensor/Switch Low Input

I used the troubleshooting software that came with the scan tool, and the most likely fix is to replace the catalytic converter. That is really expensive.

Well, the troubleshooting software also listed a technical bulletin that states that the engine wire harness ground on my s10 will sometimes cause the DTC P0420 if there is a bad connection. I want to eliminate that as a potential issue, but I don't know where the engine wire harness ground is on my truck. It doesn't list my truck's ground in the bulletin. I can't find it in the repair manuals either. Can anyone tell me where to find it?

I do want to say the I have 182,550 original miles on the current catalytic converter. It may be time to replace it.


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post #2 of 42 Old 05-18-2019, 08:05 PM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

I got this one from Amazon for my 2002.
so far, so good
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Not carb compliant. Don't know where you live.
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post #3 of 42 Old 05-18-2019, 09:46 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

If I replace the catalytic converter, I'll probably get it from Amazon. By the way, I live in California, so I guess I need a C.A.R.B compliant converter. Thank you for your response.

Will

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post #4 of 42 Old 05-18-2019, 10:18 PM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Check the electrical section on this forum, there are wiring diagrams and component location guides that may help you.




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post #5 of 42 Old 05-18-2019, 10:40 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Thankyou manbearpig. I'll check it out.

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post #6 of 42 Old 05-18-2019, 11:19 PM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Before you throw a few hundred into the wind check the wiring around your post cat O2 sensor for burns or abrasion. I'd spend $25-50 on a new post cat sensor before buying a CARB Compliant cat. If it doesn't fix it, it was a calculated gamble. Cats don't just go bad.
Your PCM and most sensors ground to the back of the cylinder head. It could be loose or rusty, but not likely in that part of CA.

Your evap codes are a whole different animal. Do some Google searches on "GM DTC P0440" and P0452. It sounds like either the wiring to or the Fuel Tank Pressure Sensor. If that's bad it'll cause both codes. PITA to get to, tho. You'll need to lift the drivers side of the bed to get to it.
Could also be a leaking gas cap seal. If you are that lucky.

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My SO has family in the area.
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post #7 of 42 Old 05-19-2019, 01:11 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Thank you for your response. This vehicle was up in Washington state for quite a while. The ground may have rusted. I want to check it out. How do I test the post cat 02 sensor?

I'll do some searches regarding P0440 and P0452. I'll see what I can find. I hope it's something as simple as a gas cap seal.

I've never been to Clint's restaurant. I didn't know he had a restaurant there, until you told me. I might go there some day. It sounds like some high quality food is there.

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post #8 of 42 Old 05-19-2019, 07:06 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

When I did an inspection on the evap system, I found one of the evap hoses completely shot. So I replaced it. I also replaced the gas cap for $12. I'm thinking about reseting my evap DTC codes to see if I've fixed the evap problems.

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post #9 of 42 Old 05-19-2019, 10:22 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

I don't have a post cat O2 sensor. According the Haynes repair manual, I only have one O2 sensor on the exhaust manifold. I looked under the truck and I didn't see one post catalytic converter.

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post #10 of 42 Old 05-19-2019, 11:37 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

So, I looked again under the truck again, and I found the post cat O2 sensor. I'm going to see if my scan tool will allow me to take live data on my post cat O2 sensor, so I can see if my catalytic converter is toast.

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post #11 of 42 Old 05-19-2019, 11:57 PM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Haynes manuals are wrong more often than they are right. Throw it out and get a FSM

The GM Factory Service manual says you have one.

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post #12 of 42 Old 05-20-2019, 12:07 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Yes! I was able to scan live data on both of my O2 sensors. It seems that my downstream O2 sensor is oscillating just like my upstream one. This means that, unfortunately, my catalytic converter is toast. I found a C.A.R.B. compliant catalytic converter on Amazon for $419. It's a direct fit, so I shouldn't have any problems installing it myself.

Hopefully, I've resolved all the issues.

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post #13 of 42 Old 05-20-2019, 12:16 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Where do I get an FSM?

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post #14 of 42 Old 05-20-2019, 12:33 AM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Ebay
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post #15 of 42 Old 05-20-2019, 12:54 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Thanks Rhotpursuit!

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post #16 of 42 Old 05-20-2019, 07:32 AM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Quote:
Originally Posted by rimawc View Post
I found a C.A.R.B. compliant catalytic converter on Amazon for $419. It's a direct fit, so I shouldn't have any problems installing it myself.
Rockauto has one for $326
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Thanks oldeerslayer. I'll check it out.

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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Hey oldeerslayer, I found the catalytic converter you were talking about. It's exactly what I need, and it saves me almost $100. Thanks.

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post #19 of 42 Old 05-20-2019, 02:06 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

I found an FSM on ebay for $20. Do the service manuals cover a variety of vehicles over the specified years. i.e. 1999-2005

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post #20 of 42 Old 05-20-2019, 02:17 PM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Specified year only. Some of the procedures may cover other years, but if it's something specific....get your year...especially for wiring. It should say what year it covers on the cover.

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post #21 of 42 Old 05-20-2019, 03:10 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Ok. Thank you Rhotpursuit.

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post #22 of 42 Old 05-20-2019, 03:18 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

I found some manuals for $175. Is that a good deal?

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post #23 of 42 Old 05-20-2019, 04:42 PM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

I'd keep looking. There are less expensive FSM out there.

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post #24 of 42 Old 05-20-2019, 06:16 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Ok. I'll keep looking.

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post #25 of 42 Old 05-20-2019, 11:04 PM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Quote:
Originally Posted by rimawc View Post
I found some manuals for $175. Is that a good deal?
Unfortunately it's seems all the manuals for anything built this century are way more expensive than for 1999 and older. I just checked ebay and a full 3 volume set for 1998 or 1999 can be had for $75. As soon as you get into 2000 they jump $100. Don't ask me why? Some are insanely priced into the many hundreds of dollars. Ridiculous.
Be patient and maybe a beat up set will show up for your 2001. It really doesn't matter if they're dirty or torn if everything is there.

Don't be tempted by the CD's that say they are the same. I bought one just to see if they were as good as they said. The one I got was missing most of the 1000 pages of electrical diagnosis. Got eBay to refund my money.
I think someone not used to working with them wouldn't initially notice the difference and that's what the sellers are banking on.
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Thanks for the tip. I'll keep my eye out for the real deal, and hopefully I can get a deal on it.

By the way, one of the codes (P0452) has been resolved. I still have P0440 though, and I know that my Catalytic converter is bad, so I have P0420 still.

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post #27 of 42 Old 05-21-2019, 09:03 AM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

P0440 is a leak in the evap system somewhere. Look over all the hoses carefully for cracks, rub marks, and the clamps.
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Ok. I'll do that. I'm also looking into these issues that I found on the web: https://www.700r4transmissionhq.com/p0440-chevy-s10/

Evap System Hose– The hose that carries the fuel vapor from the fuel tank to the intake manifold can begin to leak. This will cause the P0440 code. Look for either a tear or hole in it. This is one of the most common issues that causes the code.

Vapor Canister Purge Valve– One of the most common causes of the P0440 code is the vapor canister purge valve. It’s really easy to replace. There are a few clips that you need to find and remove.

Faulty Charcoal Canister– The charcoal canister is often the cause of P0440.

Fuel Tank Sending Unit– It is possible for the gasket that goes between the fuel sending unit to the gas tank to go bad. This can reduce tank pressure and throw the code.

Fuel Cap– A bad fuel cap can cause the code to be thrown for sure. Often, you’ll get a message informing you that the fuel cap is off even when it is on. If you are getting that message, plus a P0440, it may save you a ton of time and money to replace the fuel cap and see if it goes away.

Fuel Filler Neck– There is often a gasket where the fuel filler neck connects with the gas tank. This gasket can dry out, especially with vehicles that spend their time in dry climates. When it dries out, the fuel tank can’t hold pressure anymore.

I've already replaced the fuel cap and one of the hoses. These are the other places I need to look. I hope it's something easy!

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post #29 of 42 Old 05-21-2019, 10:46 PM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

not that long ago I sold a new paper manual,all 3 in shrink wrap for a 2001 $90.
So keep looking.
You can get a subscription to AC Delco tech connect,Mitchell on Demand or All data as another alternative
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post #30 of 42 Old 05-21-2019, 11:40 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Thanks Dime-Dozen. I'm going to check out the subscriptions.

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post #31 of 42 Old 05-22-2019, 12:46 AM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Quote:
Originally Posted by rimawc View Post
Hi I just purchased a 2001 S10 2.2L. The check engine light is on, so I put the scan tool on it, and these are the codes that came up:
P0420 (Catalyst System Low Efficiency (Bank 1)
P0440 Evaporative Emission System
P0452 Evaporative Emission System Pressure Sensor/Switch Low Input

I used the troubleshooting software that came with the scan tool, and the most likely fix is to replace the catalytic converter. That is really expensive.

Well, the troubleshooting software also listed a technical bulletin that states that the engine wire harness ground on my s10 will sometimes cause the DTC P0420 if there is a bad connection. I want to eliminate that as a potential issue, but I don't know where the engine wire harness ground is on my truck. It doesn't list my truck's ground in the bulletin. I can't find it in the repair manuals either. Can anyone tell me where to find it?

I do want to say the I have 182,550 original miles on the current catalytic converter. It may be time to replace it.
Don't know if this will help you, But it's been useful for me. Wish I could remember the guy who posted it a while back so I could credit him.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B9...Q1OTUzMmRjMWQ0

Should contain Many if not all of the diagrams you need, just add it to your google drive so you can reference it later.
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post #32 of 42 Old 05-22-2019, 07:55 AM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

The professional subscription services are good but pricey for an individual vehicle. I tried the $20/yr Alldata DIY for my 05 Silverado and am not very impressed. Won't be renewing it.
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post #33 of 42 Old 05-22-2019, 11:21 AM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

FWIW, I got a CARB-compliant cat for mine from Summit for under $150. I just had to weld it in. Even if you can't weld it yourself, it would probably still be cheaper to take it to a muffler shop and have it done.

Also, if it turns out you need a new charcoal canister (which isn't all that likely, IMO), let me know. I have one brand new in the box that I'll make you a killer deal on (assuming it's the right one for your truck).
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post #34 of 42 Old 05-22-2019, 01:18 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Thanks TopFuelMalinios. This is extremely helpful.

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post #35 of 42 Old 05-22-2019, 01:22 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Thanks TomA. I might be contacting you regarding the charcoal canister, if it's the problem. I think I'm going to stick with the direct fit catalytic converter, even though it's a little more expensive.

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post #36 of 42 Old 05-22-2019, 01:25 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Hey oldeerslayer, I think I can afford to spend around $20 a year on a subscription. As long as it's better than the Haynes manual, I'll get it.

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post #37 of 42 Old 05-22-2019, 05:09 PM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Quote:
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Thanks TopFuelMalinios. This is extremely helpful.
No Problem! Glad it helped.
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post #38 of 42 Old 05-22-2019, 07:08 PM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

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Rockauto has one for $326
I have always got good products at Rock Auto and they are usually the cheapest
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post #39 of 42 Old 05-23-2019, 01:02 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

I bought a new vapor canister purge valve for $16 on Amazon. I didn't test the old one to see if it was functioning properly, but it was cheap enough just to replace it. I saw a video on YouTube
where the purge valve was the problem. It inspired me to replace mine. It's one of the easier things to fix anyway. P.S. you don't have to take the bed off the truck, like they did in the YouTube video, to change the purge valve.

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post #40 of 42 Old 05-26-2019, 04:34 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

I just ordered my catalytic converter from rockauto. I should have it by Friday the 31st.

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post #41 of 42 Old 06-05-2019, 05:28 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

I just replaced my catalytic converter, and I just resolved the P0420 code. I found out that several months before I got the truck, it was in the shop for faulty sparkplug wires. 2 cylinders were misfiring badly. I think this is what blew out the catalytic converter in the first place.

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post #42 of 42 Old 06-05-2019, 11:58 PM
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Re: Engine wire harness Ground

Glad to hear you got it fixed.
Makes sense that there was a previous engine problem that caused the cat to fail.
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