2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods - S-10 Forum
 2Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 58 Old 08-15-2013, 12:24 PM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Since I have seen so many threads about wanting to improve power in the 60*, maybe I can offer some tips on helping these engines perform better.
First, some factory specs:
2.8 V6 (RWD 82-85) RPO: LR2 VIN: B
Engine Description (LB6) 2.8L 60 degree V6 (Carbureted)
Horsepower ([email protected]) [email protected]
Torque ([email protected]) [email protected]
Block Cast Iron
Heads Iron
Valves 12
Displacement 2.8L (2800cc, 173ci)
Bore 89mm (3.503")
Stroke 76mm (2.992")
Compression Ratio 8.5:1
Intake / Exhaust valves 1.60" / 1.30"
Valve lift .347" / .394"

2.8 V6 (RWD 85-93) RPO: LL2 VIN: R
Engine Description (LB6) 2.8L 60 degree V6 (TBI)
Horsepower ([email protected]) [email protected]
Torque ([email protected]) [email protected]
Block Cast Iron
Heads Cast Iron
Valves 12
Displacement 2.8L (2800cc, 173ci)
Bore 89mm (3.503")
Stroke 76mm (2.992")
Compression Ratio 8.9:1
Intake / Exhaust valves 1.725" / 1.425"
Valve lift .393" / .410"

Cam specs on 2.8 TBI pushrod motors:

Stock Cam:
Centerline ATDC = 109* on both sides
Duration at .50 = Intake -196* exhaust – 203*
Max lobe lift at .50 = intake -.263* exhaust -.273*
Rocker ratio = 1.5
Gross lift = intake .395” exhaust -.410”
Lobe separation =109*

The first issue is the factory camshaft in all of the S10 2.8s is JUNK (as far as performance is concerned). The lift and duration is so weak, it produces a poor power band and doesn’t help when power adders are installed. (One of the best things you can do to these engines is getting an aftermarket or GM performance cam. The stock cam duration is very short for low end power but doesn’t allow the engine to breathe well)

Some key points:
1. Intake: The intake manifold of TBI motors is very restrictive. It is best to improve your intake before your exhaust. Although it is more expensive than exhaust, it is easier to design your intake to accommodate future exhaust upgrades than it is to design your exhaust for future intake upgrades. There aren't many aftermarket manifolds available, but a longer duration cam makes ALOT of difference in intake flow. The throttle body should also be on the list of upgrades. Holley did make a 400 CFM TBI to put in place of the Stock 235CFM TBI and of course, the 4.3 TBI and boring the manifold is the best TBI improvement.
The Holley 390 CFM /Edelbrock intake is another good option. There are a few others, but they
require more creativity.

2. Exhaust: The stock exhaust is restrictive. Basically the less restriction, the easier it is for the exhaust to expel itself and makes the motor work a lot less to push exhaust out. This is why headers make such an improvement over manifolds. Manifolds usually only have 2-4 inch runners. The exhaust gas slams into the abrupt enlargement or "log" of the manifold and in turn causes quite a restriction. There are a few companies that make headers for the 60* engine.


Free and cheap mods:
Adding a little timing advance can add some torque in the bottom end sacrificing very little in the top. The theoretical hot spot of a 2.8 is 14* advance at base timing for low end torque and HP. Higher than that will take away from the upper RPM's and may cause detonation (ping).
EGR of course puts inert gas into your cylinders. This effectively reduces detonation and NOX emissions. The bad thing is it also effectively reduces your engine’s performance.
Summary- Get rid of it if you can.
A cold air intake will improve combustion.

GM TBI Specs:
Flow is lbs/hr @ 13psi

GM Part # / Engine / Flow / TBI bore

5235430 / 2.8L / 33 / 35mm

5235203 / 4.3L / 45 / 43mm

5235279 / 5.0L / 40 / 43mm

5235206 / 5.7L PU / 55 / 43mm

17084327 / 5.7L Police / 65 / 43mm

1708430 / Late BB PU / 80 / 51mm

5235231 / Early BB PU / 90 / 51mm

2.8/3.1/3.4 Power improvements:

Stage 1
A. Build a cold air intake. Parts are available on ebay for small pesos.
B. Bore the intake openings and install a larger TBI assembly. You can also install a manual fuel pressure regulator for increased pressure.
C. Advance timing to approximately 12* to 14* base timing. If the engine detonates, retard accordingly, although I think that 14* will be fine.
D. Make sure there are no restrictions in the exhaust system – particularly the cat.
E. Install an electric fan and controller.
F. Check that all tune up components are at peak efficiency. Change your oil @ 3K miles.
G. Make sure your tires are properly inflated – I run 30F and 35R.

Stage 2
A. Install a larger cat back exhaust system. 2 ” to 2 ” is good. The larger will give top end, the smaller for lower/mid-range power. There are many systems available for these trucks through Jeg’s and Summit.
B. Install a high flow cat at least 2 ” in/out. For the 2 ” use reducers at both ends. You can eliminate the cat, but I don’t recommend it due to emission laws.

Stage 3
A. Install a set of headers and run a large Y merge pipe for the exit, unless you run dual exhaust.
2 ” pipes from the headers to a Y pipe into the cat is the trick.

Stage 4
A. It’s cam time! Select an aftermarket cam with about .480 lift and .285 duration with a 10* or 12* lobe separation. You will also need new lifters. You can go with less lift/ duration but this is about right for a good power punch. Install a TRUE ROLLER double timing chain. Cloyes makes them for this application. Note how stretched the old chain was. The new unit will not stretch as quickly.

Stage 5
A. Install a set of roller rocker arms. These are not cheap, but it’s the last bolt on that you can do. They come in 2 varieties. 1.6 and 1.5 ratio (stock). The 1.6 will give more lift and a little more power.

If you do all of these stages, expect to spend close to $2K. I shopped on Ebay, Summit and Jeg’s, and IIRC this is approximately what I spent on my 3.4.
The result will be a 2.8 that puts out approximately 155 to 165 horsepower. All of this also applies to the 3.1 and 3.4 resulting in a little more power due to larger displacements.
You can go completely wild and do internal mods, (pistons, balance, porting, bigger cam etc) but that is not the intent of this thread. This will give a healthy 2.8 that will pull up hills easily. Your fuel mileage around town will suffer somewhat, but on the highway it will be ok.
I may have missed some of the minor mods that can be done, if anyone feels I have missed something, please feel free to add on.

Notes:
I have not covered any ignition systems; the ECU controls that with the TBI system.

If you go with a carb option, I am running a non-stock Mallory mechanical advance dizzy. There are other options also.

If you run a TBI system, you will never see optimum performance unless you do a ‘tune’ to the ECM. This involves running the truck on a dynamometer and adjusting the air / fuel ratio and timing for optimum performance. This procedure is somewhat complicated and requires hardware and software to interface the on board ECU with a laptop computer.

If you are really creative, you can install a multi port injection system from a Camaro/Firebird. This is proably the best option for performnce. A good tune and all of the 5 stages, I wouldn't be suprised if you could get 180 HP from a 2.8.

Thanks to s10planet.com, where I plagiarized some information.

AND you know that Confucius has to say:

Man with good 2.8 go up hill easy...


S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 58 Old 08-15-2013, 03:07 PM
Registered User
 
chevy<ford's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Dunnellon, Fl
Age: 29
Posts: 758

User is: chevy<ford is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

http://www.s10forums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2104

i believe s10 planet stole it from this post lol. good write up tho.

93 sc/sb 3.4, 2/3 drop on 20's
chevy<ford is offline  
post #3 of 58 Old 08-15-2013, 04:29 PM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

^^ Ha, they might of!
I figured that this might help everyone who wants some more poop out of their engine.

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
 
post #4 of 58 Old 08-19-2013, 10:14 AM
Should've had a V8.
 
s10_2.8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Twin Tiers, NY
Age: 25
Posts: 1,619

User is: s10_2.8 is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Lots of nice info! This should probably be stickied. I see posts about this all the time

FS: First Gen brake lights, 4.3 TB, 2.8 intake manifold, 2.8 air cleaner housing, heater core shroud, first gen sun visor.
Click the name for the thread.
1992 s10 "Old and Un-faithful" 3.4L RIP
1995 s10 "What the hell, it runs?" 2.2L Long Bed RIP
1996 Saturn SL2, 2000 SL TWIN PILES OF CRAP
s10_2.8 is offline  
post #5 of 58 Old 08-20-2013, 11:35 PM
Registered Users
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Age: 31
Posts: 9

User is: skyshadow is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Sticky quality post for sure
skyshadow is offline  
post #6 of 58 Old 08-21-2013, 03:51 PM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

More interesting info:
Tuning: Why bother?

The rise of electronic engine management allows for the running conditions of an engine to be rapidly and precisely adjusted. Before we talk about anything super technical, it’s worth examining some really basic stuff like, “why should we bother tuning a car in the first place?” ”What can we reasonably hope to accomplish?”
Sometimes we start with an engine that’s running acceptably but we want to slightly change how it operates to achieve our goals. Sometimes we start with an engine that doesn’t run at all because it is so different from the original system that was running that we have to tune it for it to run acceptably. Regardless of whether adjustments are made out of necessity or desire, the answer to this “why bother” question is simple: in a word, it is OPTIMIZATION. Tuning allows us to make the most out of the engine that we have.
What Tuning ISN’T

Tuning cars is often very misunderstood, especially by people who do not do it. There is no magic involved. You cannot wave a magic wand and violate the laws of physics in the name of making horsepower. You are dealing with a computer system that responds to sensors in a predictable way.
There is one golden rule (which I think has its origins in a completely different realm) which applies here:
Garbage In, Garbage Out.

As a tuner, you can only work with what you are given. This may seem so obvious that it is a waste of time to even say it. Trust me. It isn’t. It’s critical. And at some point if you mess around with tuning vehicles long enough, you will get so focused on the knobs and buttons available to turn on your computer that you will forget about the mechanical system you are controlling.
  • Changing a computer program can’t fix mechanical issues.
  • Changing a computer program can’t fix electrical issues.
  • Changing a computer program can’t make more air enter an engine than it can mechanically pump
  • Changing a computer program can’t make more fuel flow through pumps/injectors than they can mechanically pump
  • Bottom line: You can’t make pigs fly by pushing buttons. The physical motor you are working with will define what you do on the computer.
Tuning Possibilities

So if we are inherently limited by the physical engine that we are dealing with, what CAN we typically accomplish with tuning?

Typically, we can:
  • Increase power / torque output of the engine
  • Increase efficiency / decrease fuel consumption
  • Decrease noxious emissions (Carbon Dioxide/CO2, hydrocarbons/HC, Carbon Monoxide/CO, Nitrous oxide/N2O, Nitrogen Oxides/NOx)
  • Control NVH (Noise – Vibration – Harshness)
  • Decrease stress on mechanical components / prevent damage to mechanical components
  • Many of these goals require different operating conditions making it impossible to do all of them at once!
Conclusion

Tuning isn’t magic. Modifying electronic engine control systems lets you get the most out of the physical system that you’re working with. Through tuning, you can choose how to operate an engine in order to achieve the goals that are most important to you, making the compromises you want to make. The goal of this course is going to be to teach you to use a calculator/simple math and data logging combined with an understanding of underlying processes to make targeted and appropriate changes in order to achieve the operating conditions you desire for your engine.

Information courtesy of Craig Moates... Thank you

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #7 of 58 Old 08-21-2013, 09:04 PM
Registered User
 
prymdym's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Red Deer, AB
Age: 34
Posts: 334

User is: prymdym is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Ok, so where do you find a cam for these 2.8l piles of poop?
prymdym is offline  
post #8 of 58 Old 08-22-2013, 09:20 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

What are you going to run? Mods or totally stock?
This might be a good start...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Chevy-S-10-V...aa23e0&vxp=mtr

There are many more companies that make performance cams.
http://www.oregoncamshaft.com/performance-car.html

http://www.cranecams.com/50-51.pdf

http://www.iskycams.com/onlinecatalog.html

http://bulletcams.com/index.shtml - I have one of these in my 3.4

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #9 of 58 Old 08-22-2013, 07:53 PM
Registered User
 
prymdym's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Red Deer, AB
Age: 34
Posts: 334

User is: prymdym is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

I was thinking stock bottom end, she's still pretty healthy. Ive found lots of "seemed like a good idea" brand new parts sitting in peoples garages, so i'll upgrade top end. I want it to sound better, doesnt need to be fast, i love a nice lope! Everyone says **** the 2.8 but it has to last me a couple years while we build the new frame and i find an lsx to build.
prymdym is offline  
post #10 of 58 Old 08-26-2013, 08:23 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

I built a 3.4 as everyone here probably knows by now. It has a crazy cam in it and a complete 3" custom exhaust. It sounds very little like a 60* V6, more like pro stock drag truck with a little higher pitch to the exhaust note. It fools everyone.
When you drive at low speeds, it has a nasty lope and rumble. Not loud, but you know it's not messing around. When you stand on it, it sounds wild.

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #11 of 58 Old 08-30-2013, 09:57 AM
Awww..you ain't got shit!
 
jimmykicker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: McCalla, Alabama
Age: 47
Posts: 3,216

User is: jimmykicker is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

email What! for sticky...or is it What?



1984 xcab s-10 3.4L GM crate engine 91 S10 TBI swap w bored intake, Edelbrock headers. 2" Rough Country Lift. Flowmaster, shift kit, e-fan.
The S-5 trailer-Half a 1st Gen LWB S-10


EFI swap https://www.s10forum.com/forum/f106/...e-help-513616/

My build thread (3.4L)https://www.s10forum.com/forum/f106/...stions-427168/
Quote:
Originally Posted by Racer_X View Post
I had to cut my nut in half .
jimmykicker is offline  
post #12 of 58 Old 08-30-2013, 11:04 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmykicker View Post
email What! for sticky...or is it What?

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #13 of 58 Old 09-06-2013, 10:01 AM
Awww..you ain't got shit!
 
jimmykicker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: McCalla, Alabama
Age: 47
Posts: 3,216

User is: jimmykicker is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Seriously man...it is "what?"....that's his username. I emailed him and he made it a sticky.



1984 xcab s-10 3.4L GM crate engine 91 S10 TBI swap w bored intake, Edelbrock headers. 2" Rough Country Lift. Flowmaster, shift kit, e-fan.
The S-5 trailer-Half a 1st Gen LWB S-10


EFI swap https://www.s10forum.com/forum/f106/...e-help-513616/

My build thread (3.4L)https://www.s10forum.com/forum/f106/...stions-427168/
Quote:
Originally Posted by Racer_X View Post
I had to cut my nut in half .
jimmykicker is offline  
post #14 of 58 Old 09-08-2013, 07:31 PM
Registered User
 
chevy<ford's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Dunnellon, Fl
Age: 29
Posts: 758

User is: chevy<ford is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

max you got a link to the roller rockers? I cant findout wether they are 10mm studs or 3/8 studs on the 3.4.

93 sc/sb 3.4, 2/3 drop on 20's
chevy<ford is offline  
post #15 of 58 Old 09-08-2013, 07:34 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: The Nest
Age: 42
Posts: 2,122

User is: The_Raven is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

They are metric, ALL fasteners on all GM 60 degree V6 are metric.

Yukon: The daily driver
Tha toy: 1973 Datsun 240z 12.71 @115
Tha other Toy: 1923 T-Bucket
Another Toy: 1987 Buick Skyhawk
Typhony Old set-up: 1985 GMC Jimmy. 3.2L Turbocharged/Intercooled hybrid. 13.873 @ 99.08 Currently being reconstructed.


"If you're not living on the edge, You're taking up too much space."
The_Raven is offline  
post #16 of 58 Old 09-09-2013, 12:45 PM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Chev/Ferd, when I bought my roller rockers, they came with new ARP screw in studs and poly locks. The rockers apparently are 3/8th studs whereas the head has 10 MM studs for the factory rockers.
Here's the link:
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cr...make/chevrolet
More options:
http://www.summitracing.com/search?S...ller%20rockers

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #17 of 58 Old 09-09-2013, 05:38 PM
Registered User
 
chevy<ford's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Dunnellon, Fl
Age: 29
Posts: 758

User is: chevy<ford is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

thanks for the links im prob gonna get a set of http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-1414-12 since im not looking for huge amounts of power just gonna do a 3.4 with the 260 cam and roller rockers and 4.3 injectors.

Also thnx for confirming they r indeed 10mm i couldnt remember and googling wasnt showing it up.

93 sc/sb 3.4, 2/3 drop on 20's
chevy<ford is offline  
post #18 of 58 Old 09-10-2013, 08:56 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by chevy<ford View Post
thanks for the links im prob gonna get a set of http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cca-1414-12 since im not looking for huge amounts of power just gonna do a 3.4 with the 260 cam and roller rockers and 4.3 injectors.

Also thnx for confirming they r indeed 10mm i couldnt remember and googling wasnt showing it up.
Good plan Dood. 1.6 ratio will give a little more power because of the additional lift invlolved.
A 3.4 will give you some pretty good bag with the right combo of parts.

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #19 of 58 Old 09-10-2013, 09:02 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmykicker View Post
Seriously man...it is "what?"....that's his username. I emailed him and he made it a sticky.
Cool. I thought it was a joke or something.
Meh, if he sees this and thinks it's worth a sticky, he'll tag it.
All I'm doing is helping out with the same question... over and over... more power.
All of this stuff is from past experience - the way to go. No guess work.
I hope it helps someone out.

Confucius say: Power need? Make nitrous...

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #20 of 58 Old 09-10-2013, 09:37 AM
Should've had a V8.
 
s10_2.8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Twin Tiers, NY
Age: 25
Posts: 1,619

User is: s10_2.8 is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Max View Post
Confucius say: Power need? Make nitrous...
Nitrous is like a hot chick with an STD. you want to hit it, but you're afraid of the consequences.

FS: First Gen brake lights, 4.3 TB, 2.8 intake manifold, 2.8 air cleaner housing, heater core shroud, first gen sun visor.
Click the name for the thread.
1992 s10 "Old and Un-faithful" 3.4L RIP
1995 s10 "What the hell, it runs?" 2.2L Long Bed RIP
1996 Saturn SL2, 2000 SL TWIN PILES OF CRAP
s10_2.8 is offline  
post #21 of 58 Old 09-10-2013, 10:00 AM
Awww..you ain't got shit!
 
jimmykicker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: McCalla, Alabama
Age: 47
Posts: 3,216

User is: jimmykicker is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Max View Post
Cool. I thought it was a joke or something.
Meh, if he sees this and thinks it's worth a sticky, he'll tag it.
All I'm doing is helping out with the same question... over and over... more power.
All of this stuff is from past experience - the way to go. No guess work.
I hope it helps someone out.

Confucius say: Power need? Make nitrous...
Nah...they won't sticky shit unless you ask...



1984 xcab s-10 3.4L GM crate engine 91 S10 TBI swap w bored intake, Edelbrock headers. 2" Rough Country Lift. Flowmaster, shift kit, e-fan.
The S-5 trailer-Half a 1st Gen LWB S-10


EFI swap https://www.s10forum.com/forum/f106/...e-help-513616/

My build thread (3.4L)https://www.s10forum.com/forum/f106/...stions-427168/
Quote:
Originally Posted by Racer_X View Post
I had to cut my nut in half .
jimmykicker is offline  
post #22 of 58 Old 09-11-2013, 08:51 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimmykicker View Post
Nah...they won't sticky shit unless you ask...
Oh, I didn't realize that. I guess I was misinformed.
Is this really worth a sticky?

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #23 of 58 Old 09-11-2013, 09:07 AM
Should've had a V8.
 
s10_2.8's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Twin Tiers, NY
Age: 25
Posts: 1,619

User is: s10_2.8 is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

For sure.

FS: First Gen brake lights, 4.3 TB, 2.8 intake manifold, 2.8 air cleaner housing, heater core shroud, first gen sun visor.
Click the name for the thread.
1992 s10 "Old and Un-faithful" 3.4L RIP
1995 s10 "What the hell, it runs?" 2.2L Long Bed RIP
1996 Saturn SL2, 2000 SL TWIN PILES OF CRAP
s10_2.8 is offline  
post #24 of 58 Old 09-17-2014, 09:51 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Dug this up again for you guys that want more poop out of your 60 degree V6s.

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #25 of 58 Old 09-17-2014, 10:43 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Additional carb info:
There are 2 aftermarket manifolds for these enignes.
1. The common Edlebrock intake. It offers 2 intake tops, one for the stock 82 - 85 Rochester, the other top is for a Holley 4 barrel.
2. Offenhauser makes a "Daul Port" 4 barrel intake which is VERY rare.



I don't know how welll this works, I have never used it.
Check this out:


Here's a third option:
Custom built...

Tunnel ram intake. Probably not too good for a street driven truck.


Anyway, you get the idea.
There are other combinations. They mostly use a 4 barrel intake, but then use a fuel injection system that is stand alone and uses a Holley "Pro-jection" or similar bolt on system. These are totally tuneable by the user.
I guess I'm going into the high end performance which of course means big $$.

I think someone on the forum used the Edelbrock intake and ran the TBI by adapting it to the manifold. That may offer another alternative by keeping the TBI.

A few additional intake options:
Weber 38/38 Outlaw carb mounted on a stock or better yet... Edelbrock intake.
You can also use a 32/36 Weber on the stock or Edelbrock intake. This carb will give good fuel mileage, but will somewhat limit higher power output.

Here is a one off custom intake for 3 Weber 2 barrel downdrafts:

I will have to custom machine alot of parts to make this work. I have never seen another like it.

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #26 of 58 Old 09-22-2014, 09:58 PM
overthinker extraordinar
 
jcricket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: littleton colorado
Age: 54
Posts: 650

User is: jcricket is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Max View Post
What are you going to run? Mods or totally stock?
This might be a good start...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Chevy-S-10-V...aa23e0&vxp=mtr

There are many more companies that make performance cams.
http://www.oregoncamshaft.com/performance-car.html

http://www.cranecams.com/50-51.pdf

http://www.iskycams.com/onlinecatalog.html

http://bulletcams.com/index.shtml - I have one of these in my 3.4

Hey Madmax,
I was looking at the crane cams in one of your links. The first one listed the H192-2667-25-12 says "Brute low end torque". Would this mean more power at the line? Not necessarily speed, but pulling capacity?
Would it also give better fuel economy? What if you also put in higher gears with this cam, lets say a 3.08?
Just thinking. Do I have the right idea?

85 S10 Durango 2.8L extcab rwd 36k actual miles.
"true wisdom is knowing you know nothing" Paraphrased from Socrates
jcricket is offline  
post #27 of 58 Old 09-23-2014, 09:05 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcricket View Post
Hey Madmax,
I was looking at the crane cams in one of your links. The first one listed the H192-2667-25-12 says "Brute low end torque". Would this mean more power at the line? Not necessarily speed, but pulling capacity?
Would it also give better fuel economy? What if you also put in higher gears with this cam, lets say a 3.08?
Just thinking. Do I have the right idea?
Usually the low end torque cams are better with fuel economy and give good power to about 4000 to 4500 RPM. The "off line" power is noticeably better than the stock cam and would probably be no problem with a 3.08 gear, depending on what you add for intake and exhaust and manual or auto transmission.
If you were to gain 15 HPs at the low end (which is possible), you would notice a substantial difference, and at cruising speeds, it would pull a 3.08.
Of course, a manual tranny would work better with the 3.08

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #28 of 58 Old 09-23-2014, 09:21 AM
overthinker extraordinar
 
jcricket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: littleton colorado
Age: 54
Posts: 650

User is: jcricket is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Thanks!!!!
Would that cam I listed work with a stock motor? I would probably need new lifters and roller rockers. Would I need anything else if I wanted to put that in?

85 S10 Durango 2.8L extcab rwd 36k actual miles.
"true wisdom is knowing you know nothing" Paraphrased from Socrates
jcricket is offline  
post #29 of 58 Old 09-23-2014, 10:05 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcricket View Post
Thanks!!!!
Would that cam I listed work with a stock motor? I would probably need new lifters and roller rockers. Would I need anything else if I wanted to put that in?
Yes, it would be great with an otherwise stock engine. You will need new lifters, but roller rockers would be optional. You generally don't need roller rockers until you get into a 1/2" of cam lift (.500).

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #30 of 58 Old 09-24-2014, 09:06 PM
Registered User
 
bud's84's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Western Mass.
Age: 36
Posts: 55

User is: bud's84 is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Got any links for those ARP screw in studs? I got the comp 1.52 roller tips and the pivot/nuts that came with it are the 3/8". What to do???
bud's84 is offline  
post #31 of 58 Old 09-25-2014, 07:43 AM
overthinker extraordinar
 
jcricket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: littleton colorado
Age: 54
Posts: 650

User is: jcricket is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Max View Post
Yes, it would be great with an otherwise stock engine. You will need new lifters, but roller rockers would be optional. You generally don't need roller rockers until you get into a 1/2" of cam lift (.500).
I was looking for any issues related to using this cam. I did find one. Here in the US, if you live in an emission controlled area, the use of this cam would be "illegal". Your car would likely not pass emissions and there fore you could not register it and get plates. At lease this is my understanding.

I am going to go to the motor vehicle in the next few days and get some clarification on the issues before I spend the money for the parts.

85 S10 Durango 2.8L extcab rwd 36k actual miles.
"true wisdom is knowing you know nothing" Paraphrased from Socrates
jcricket is offline  
post #32 of 58 Old 09-25-2014, 09:35 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Unless you live in Cali, most every state exempts vehicles the are older than a 96 model year. This is when OBD II was required on all vehicles and they usually plug them into a computer to detect problems. Prior to 96, most vehicles were OBD I or carbed. I am pretty sure you will not have a problem with your vehicle. Does Colorado have emission sniffers for inspection?
There are many states that don't do safety or emission inspections.

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #33 of 58 Old 09-25-2014, 04:04 PM
overthinker extraordinar
 
jcricket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: littleton colorado
Age: 54
Posts: 650

User is: jcricket is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

they do an test and visual inspection. The test is on a dynamometer(sp). It check for the three biggies. Once my car reaches 32 years old they do a simple 2 speed idle test.

They do have some exemptions for custom and home built cars. I was going to go ask what is required to be custom. So if I built my motor, changed some rear end gearing, added gauges, changed the paint, is that custom enough?
I'll find out

85 S10 Durango 2.8L extcab rwd 36k actual miles.
"true wisdom is knowing you know nothing" Paraphrased from Socrates
jcricket is offline  
post #34 of 58 Old 09-26-2014, 11:15 AM
overthinker extraordinar
 
jcricket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: littleton colorado
Age: 54
Posts: 650

User is: jcricket is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Hey Mad Max,
I have been corresponding with the customer service guy over at Crane Cams. The cam in question is also designed to be used in smog controlled vehicles and is legal in all states that have not adopted California standards. The cam also increases fuel efficiency. I do not know how much but I di a quick calculation based on a guess of 10% increase in efficiency.

The cam, lifters, gaskets, and shipping will run me about $350. If I realize a 10% increase, then at $3.50 a gallon that is $0.35 per gallon savings. Divide the $350 cost by that and it will take about 1000 gallons to recoup the cost. Since I am getting about 18 mpg, that would be about 18k miles driven to recoup. I drive about 1k miles a month so it would take 18 months to recoup. And, I would be having the better low end torque and performance I wanted all that time.

Seems like a no brainer if you have the $350 and the skill to do the install.

I'll be ordering the parts next week.

thanks again,
mark

85 S10 Durango 2.8L extcab rwd 36k actual miles.
"true wisdom is knowing you know nothing" Paraphrased from Socrates
jcricket is offline  
post #35 of 58 Old 10-02-2014, 07:26 PM
overthinker extraordinar
 
jcricket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: littleton colorado
Age: 54
Posts: 650

User is: jcricket is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Mad max,
what do you think of this kit from sumit racing?
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cc...make/chevrolet

duration of 252/252 and a lift of .425/.425

thoughts on how it would perform?

85 S10 Durango 2.8L extcab rwd 36k actual miles.
"true wisdom is knowing you know nothing" Paraphrased from Socrates
jcricket is offline  
post #36 of 58 Old 10-03-2014, 09:59 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by jcricket View Post
Mad max,
what do you think of this kit from sumit racing?
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/cc...make/chevrolet

duration of 252/252 and a lift of .425/.425

thoughts on how it would perform?
I did some research in the past, this is almost identical to the cam that comes in the GM 3.4 crate engine. It's alot better than the stock 2.8 cam, I think I posted the specs at the beginning of this thread.
If mileage and low end is your goal, this cam will fit the bill.
BTW, shop around, I bought one of my cams on Ebay for $80, and lifters were another $65 IIRC.
I've seen many guys buy these cams and never get around to installing them. They sell them cheap, but you have to have good timing....

Here ya go:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Chevy-2-8-3-...#ht_1145wt_885

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #37 of 58 Old 10-03-2014, 06:07 PM
overthinker extraordinar
 
jcricket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: littleton colorado
Age: 54
Posts: 650

User is: jcricket is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

What about this guy?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/191268125573

I noticed the torque spec chart shows this with a performance manifold and 1.5" headers. I do not have either of these items. Will that be a problem?

I am leaving for the weekend.
See you folks later!
mark

85 S10 Durango 2.8L extcab rwd 36k actual miles.
"true wisdom is knowing you know nothing" Paraphrased from Socrates
jcricket is offline  
post #38 of 58 Old 10-15-2014, 11:48 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Just saw your post about this cam. The problem with running this cam and the stock intake/exhaust is it won't be able to give you the maximum output it was designed for.
The Rochester carb will definately be a loser too. I am guessing it will be WAY too lean and won't be able to idle well at all.
With headers and an intake, you will probably be totally surprised at how much more power the engine will make.
Gas mileage will suffer though...

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #39 of 58 Old 10-16-2014, 05:45 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Age: 27
Posts: 68

User is: x1991Dimex is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Im currently in the process of turboing my '91 2.8 5speed dime.

Im getting alot of my parts from 3rd gen camaro like intake and injectors and rail and stuff

And ill everything else from ARI's website. They specialize in all that.


Head work
Cams
Bottom end
Top end
Everything..
I currently have a list of 99% of everything I need. Minus the small misc stuff.
x1991Dimex is offline  
post #40 of 58 Old 10-16-2014, 09:32 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by x1991Dimex View Post
Im currently in the process of turboing my '91 2.8 5speed dime.

Im getting alot of my parts from 3rd gen camaro like intake and injectors and rail and stuff

And ill everything else from ARI's website. They specialize in all that.


Head work
Cams
Bottom end
Top end
Everything..
I currently have a list of 99% of everything I need. Minus the small misc stuff.

Sounds cool. Any pics?

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #41 of 58 Old 10-16-2014, 09:01 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Age: 27
Posts: 68

User is: x1991Dimex is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

I have a build thread. But havent been able to work on this much. Need a day off... 6-7 days a week 10 hours a day. Lol no time for anything but next couple of weeks I am going to get some stuff done to it
x1991Dimex is offline  
post #42 of 58 Old 11-28-2014, 09:49 PM
overthinker extraordinar
 
jcricket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: littleton colorado
Age: 54
Posts: 650

User is: jcricket is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

bump so I can find this thread

85 S10 Durango 2.8L extcab rwd 36k actual miles.
"true wisdom is knowing you know nothing" Paraphrased from Socrates
jcricket is offline  
post #43 of 58 Old 12-02-2014, 08:39 PM
overthinker extraordinar
 
jcricket's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: littleton colorado
Age: 54
Posts: 650

User is: jcricket is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Hey Max,
I have been studying the numbers on the motors that you posted. I have a questions. I noticed the differences between the carbureted and TBI motors was the compression, the size of the valves, and the valve lift. Could a person put an intake manifold and carb on a TBI motor? I cannot see why you couldn't. Secondly, could the heads(the larger valve size) be used on the older carbed engines? Would that also increase performance a bit?

And then with that thought, I was wondering what the heads of the 3.4 would do on a 2.8 motor? I have a line on a set of 3.4 heads for free, just need rebuilding.

85 S10 Durango 2.8L extcab rwd 36k actual miles.
"true wisdom is knowing you know nothing" Paraphrased from Socrates
jcricket is offline  
post #44 of 58 Old 12-02-2014, 11:20 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: The Nest
Age: 42
Posts: 2,122

User is: The_Raven is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

The iron heads are the same from 1986 to the end of production. That includes the heads on the 2.8, 3.1 and 3.4, all the same. So 3.4 heads will show no improvement over using 2.8 heads.

Also the above heads are the same for all intents and purposes as the earlier "HO" heads that were commonly found on the 2.8 in the Citation X11.

The external physical dimensions are the same for the entire run of the iron heads, so yes you can swap intakes.

Yukon: The daily driver
Tha toy: 1973 Datsun 240z 12.71 @115
Tha other Toy: 1923 T-Bucket
Another Toy: 1987 Buick Skyhawk
Typhony Old set-up: 1985 GMC Jimmy. 3.2L Turbocharged/Intercooled hybrid. 13.873 @ 99.08 Currently being reconstructed.


"If you're not living on the edge, You're taking up too much space."
The_Raven is offline  
post #45 of 58 Old 06-07-2017, 08:36 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

I blew the dust off of this thread so maybe you 2.8 /3.1 /3.4 guys can learn a little about these engines.
Maybe it will become a sticky (?)

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #46 of 58 Old 06-09-2017, 01:28 AM
Registered User
 
RecklessCreation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Ladysmith BC
Posts: 49

User is: RecklessCreation is offline
Garage
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

at what size of cam does running 1.6 roller rockers require additional work to the heads?

can stock 2.8 TBI ECU handle : 4.3 tbi unit with 4.3 injectors, comp 260H cam, 1.6 rockers?

assuming bored/ported intake and heads, and headers.


building a hot rod via S10 chassis ... trying really hard to atleast drive it once or twice before going back to 2.5 years of solid college in sept. haha ... all the bits will be swapped to a 3.4 with better care to the internals, and probably a turbo and proper tuning.

just wanna know if the 2.8 unit can handle it resonably well until then
RecklessCreation is offline  
post #47 of 58 Old 06-09-2017, 08:26 AM Thread Starter
Boozebag
 
Mad Max's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posts: 8,835

User is: Mad Max is offline
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

Quote:
Originally Posted by RecklessCreation View Post

can stock 2.8 TBI ECU handle : 4.3 tbi unit with 4.3 injectors, comp 260H cam, 1.6 rockers? assuming bored/ported intake and heads, and headers.

If you do the 4.3 TBI, as you know, you will need to open the intake under the TBI. The 2.8 ECU will run it, but you will want to add an adjustable fuel pressure reggy.
Headers are good, but you will need to add a bigger exhaust system behind them.

Roller rockers are expensive. If you add 1.6 ratio, you will be adding a little lift to the cam specs. The comp 260 H is a pretty mild cam, although it is a TON better than the stocker. As you probably know, you'll need new lifters too, and will need to run "break in" oil for the new cam. It has ZDDP in it which is a high pressure additive.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zinc_dithiophosphate


You can run a pretty large cam with 1.6 rockers. The Voodoo truck has a .500 lift cam with 292 duration. I HAD to run roller rockers. I was driving back from NY State and a rocker stud snapped.
Crane rockers come with ARP screw in studs. I haven't had any more problems.

S10 addiction:
1)'82 S10, 383, 700R4, Shorty
2) '85 S10, 3.4, 700R4 4x4 stretch cab (Redneck)
3) '90 S10 2.5, 5 speed shorty
4) '91 S10, Built 3.4, 5 speed shorty (Voodoo)
5) '92 S10, 2.5, 5 speed shorty, (Barbie)
6) '92 S10, 2.5 5 speed, Shorty
7) 1979 LUV, Buick 3.8 V6, TH 350 Shorty.
Mad Max is offline  
post #48 of 58 Old 06-09-2017, 10:48 AM
Registered User
 
RecklessCreation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Ladysmith BC
Posts: 49

User is: RecklessCreation is offline
Garage
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

yeah theres a lot there I'm aware of (quick background ... injury retired Tech/fabricator ... currently an auto parts counter jockey while going back to college for mech engineering )

so at work I can get crane, comp, arp , hedman etc etc ... so while not cheap, prices are nicer looking at stuff like arp kits, roller rockers

is your Voodoo truck posted on here? realistically anything more then 250-300 hp in this particular build will be wasted ... I really want to stay with the 60 degree v6 simply to keep down the weight up front, and keep it farther back too ... theres basically no drag racing around here... minimal autoX ... so building more towards corner carving then just going fast staight line

the hot rod i'm doing is still using the s10 firewall/front floor and amenities
RecklessCreation is offline  
post #49 of 58 Old 06-18-2017, 03:28 PM
Registered User
 
RecklessCreation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Ladysmith BC
Posts: 49

User is: RecklessCreation is offline
Garage
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

I've later realized that the begining of my reply above may have been 'dickish', and was not intended to be

while I do have alot of experience with engines, etc and custom work I have never nor will I ever claim to know everything. I'm on this site because I've had little to no experience with the 60deg v6

kinda trying to pick some of my parts in the thinking of switching to the 3.4 later... and/or addition of turbo (I may do initial testing etc of turbo on the 2.8, ya know... grenade the 2.8 not the 3.4 LOL )


In that regards ... I'm guessing a 260 grind would be better to focus on? it wouldn't give full gains in the initial (although still a drastic improvement over stock cam ) .. but should be better suited for a turbo later

looking at doing the 454 TBI too (with 4.3 injectors.. tweak with fuel pressure) .. again it wouldn't show any real gains on the N/A 2.8 .. maybe some throttle response .. bit of a headache to tweak in for the n/a .. but would definately help for a turbo later. (basically like down jetting a carb that's too big for an engine )


is there any decent threads or sites...etc for opening up/porting the tbi intake manifold and heads? I haven't touched a set of heads in years .. and even then the last set was just a clean up they barely even needed a port match ..

ofcourse my next journey will be into the Eprom tuning and that I have no idea how to make a run at
RecklessCreation is offline  
post #50 of 58 Old 07-09-2017, 04:37 PM
Registered User
 
RecklessCreation's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Location: Ladysmith BC
Posts: 49

User is: RecklessCreation is offline
Garage
Re: 2.8 and 60* V6 Performance Mods

okay ... the TBI swap thing .... there is SOOOO much conflicting information out there

4.3 tbi on the 2.8 ... which freaking injectors ? just as many people say the 4.3 injectors the ecm can't compensate for and you have to switch to 2.8 injectors ... as the 4.3 injectors are fine

melling MTC5 cam (think staggered 260 cam)
1.6 ratio stamped rockers
early sbc (302/z28) spring
DIY port matched and opened up intake and heads
headers
elec fan
AIR and egr deletes
possibly underdrive pulleys if I can get my hands on em
bump the static timing

I'll be doing a few of the small 'tbi' unit mods ... smoothing the top ridges, lifting the injectors... and running a completely custom built aircleaner housing with a 'bowl' type feed to the tbi unit via an neat oval edelbrock aircleaner

(I'll be attempting to make it look like hillborn/ITB outside covering the tbi but that has nothing to do with performance)

4.3 injectors? ... 5.0 injectors? ... or just FPR with the 2.8s? the 2.8 rebuild is a compromise of OEM cross parts that are close enough to the big name bits and also makes my rebuild cost like 1/3rd canadian then the prices I was looking at (ie crane cam/rockers/springs ...etc) If I like the project once it's 'streetable' a hybrid 3.4/3500 will replace it etc

87 s10 std cab long box ===> being hacked and rebuilt into a rebodied ratty hot rod

2014 grand caravan - daily driver, people/stuff mover, 30mpg, nearly 300hp couch on wheels
RecklessCreation is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the S-10 Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address.


Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome