Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two)

[JACKEL]

Quote: Originally Posted by fastSdime

Man your like the DJD of fiberglassin... LOL Thanks. I went and started measuring for the box in my 96 which should hold 2 or 3 tens. And I have to measure for my 91 which will hold 4 eights. The 91 will be simple design but still use fiberglass to make it clean and the 96 will be all out like yours. I was going to do a blow thru till I seen this.

Blow throughs are a good idea and very economical mean for saving room. However, with one, you give up another, you know what I mean. Blow throughs mean that you give up bed area and, in my opinion, only look good if they have been covered by a fiberglass cover over the bed or something. I have a stepside, and again in my opinion, 99% of the fiberglass covers I see for stepsides look like shit and make me want to hurl, lol. Just kidding, but I really don't get my kicks off seeing the bed covered.

As far as the DJD thing, I appreciate the compliments. But, really, anyone can be the DJD of fiberglassing if they take their time and try to understand what they are doing rather than just throwing something together and saying, "look, my fiberglassing project this...." or that.

Ample thought into anything can accomplish a goal.

Out of respect for DJD, I'll take the titles of "Fiberglass Man" or better yet, "The Magician" or, "The Fiberglass Magician", yeah, that sounds more like it, and you can just call me "Magician" for shortout, lol.

Come to St. Louis, you'll see.

[JACKEL]

Double post

[JACKEL]

Ok, I ordered the glass from U.S. Composites over that of Wicks. I thought I'd give them a try. So far, un-impressed. I recievced no confirmation of purchase e-mail and they hadn't charged my card yet so I had to call them and re-order it. Their on-line ordering needs some work. I'm saving a little money with them but at the moment, I think I should have gone with Wicks. I would have had it already.

If you order from U.S. Comp, call them to place the order or use the form they have on the site and fax it in.

Just and FYI

[fastSdime]

Thats cool. And I know what you mean. Its a lose/lose situation. I use to have a blow thru but it was thru my back window with a solid side topper. But now I'm tryin to keep as much as I can out of my bed. All my bag stuff is going under the bed and I'm going to lift the bed floor so its still solid. I can lose a click on my seat thats about it.

And I'll be out that way for S10 Nats. I mean its only 5 hours. But I'm a poor minitrucker so payin for hotels and shit suck and the truck is soon to have a SBC in it so gas isn't going to be the greatest either.. LOL But I'll find you if your around come Nats.

[jherrell]

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

The oem speaker grills for the dash that these pods were made on have 2 little hooks built in for 2 slots on the dash. You normally would slide these in and then press down and secure them with the two screws. In this case, the fiberglass wrapping around the edges build up the over all surface area of the grill. Now, All I have to do is slide these hooks into the slots and firmly press the pod into the dash. Its a tight fit and once pressed in, its actually hard as hell to get out. You have to be reaaly careful when getting them out so you don't scratch paint.

Hey Nick, what did you do with the little light sensor that resides in the stock passenger side speaker grill?

BTW, the dash pods look great.

Slash

[Chappy316]

Quote: Originally Posted by jherrell

Hey Nick, what did you do with the little light sensor that resides in the stock passenger side speaker grill?

i would say you prolly have to do the resistor mod so that you can disconnect it and control your headlights manually. or you could always flush it into the back side of the pod so it can still see but its not right out front.

i personally would do the resistor mod because it would help with the cleanliness...


sorry nick, figured id help out though

[JACKEL]

Quote: Originally Posted by jherrell

Hey Nick, what did you do with the little light sensor that resides in the stock passenger side speaker grill?

BTW, the dash pods look great.

Slash

I shaved it if you will. I shoved it down into the hole for the speaker. Its use is pretty much obsolete because the headlights are on during the day and night. So I just discarded it by getting it out of the way and pushing it into the hole. This sensor senses the light outside. If your lights are on during the day, and during the night, then the sensor sensing the darkness from inside the dash is a moot point. Easiest shave ever, just move it out of the way.

[JACKEL]

Small update:

Whether here lately has been warm enough for me to lay the intial coat of resin on the console. I'll do that tonight. I also got my Carlington Marine rocker switch in for the Pancake option on the switches and I got all 4 Autometer Ultra-Lite air pressure guages in yesterday for the console. I might mock up the guages so you all can get an idea of it. Tonight, I'll also start sanding on the dash and probably have most of its mock up done this weekend too.

Also, Got,
The steel braided hydrualic lines for my scuba tanks;
Got the high pressure y-block for the scuba tanks
Got the new mounting sleeve for the headunit.
Got the large guage wiring for the audio

But, I'm still waiting on my glass. Hell, I'd be done by now if I weren't waiting on U.S. Comp.

Anyway, some real progress will soon start to be made.

[JACKEL]

Small Update:

I got the Autometer 2 1/16th Ultra-Lite Guages 0 - 150 PSI air pressure guage. Got 4 of them, one for each bag. I hated the look of the KP dual needle guages, or frankly on dual needle guage offered.

Since I already have a couple Ultr0Lite guages and love the look, I decided to match them with these 4 guages of same type.

I very roughly mocked one up to show you all. I still have to size the hole a little for the guages to just drop in.

[BIGGERISBETTER]

them r' sweet fella.. will look nice

[fastSdime]

Looking good Nick...

[Chappy316]

get your fiberglass and get going on these project NOW!!

[JACKEL]

Quote: Originally Posted by Chappy316

get your fiberglass and get going on these project NOW!!

I would if I could. F-n U.S. Composites is the slowest God damn, mother - f-n, son-of-a-bitc*&n, cock smack'n place I've ever seen. I swear to god Molasace in the winter flows faster than them.

GOD DAMN!!

[Chappy316]

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

I would if I could. F-n U.S. Composites is the slowest God damn, mother - f-n, son-of-a-bitc*&n, cock smack'n place I've ever seen. I swear to god Molasace in the winter flows faster than them.

GOD DAMN!!

hey atleast your taking it out on the forum and not the family right?

sorry but im just trying to be positive and that about the only positive thing that i can even try to pull from that last statement... lol

[JACKEL]

Quote: Originally Posted by Chappy316

hey atleast your taking it out on the forum and not the family right?

sorry but im just trying to be positive and that about the only positive thing that i can even try to pull from that last statement... lol

Well I just got smack-ity on the phone with them a second ago and told them I'd order from Wicks if they didn't get a move on. I guess them and Wicks are big competitors cause I just lit the fire under their ass. Ther're shipping it out now and I'll have it by next Wed.

I knew you were trying to be positive. Hell, me too, but you can only stay positive for so long when you're in the holding pattern cause of someone else's slow ass ways.

[Chappy316]

updates, updates, UPDATES!

[JACKEL]

Quote: Originally Posted by Chappy316

updates, updates, UPDATES!

Still waiting on U.S. Composites. I don't think I'll order from them again in the future. I'll stick to my tried and true, Wicks.

It was way to damn cold here last weekend to do any resin or epoxy mixing anyway. It was 18* in my garage. So instead, I froze my ass off for a while sanding on some of the other plastic pieces left to be painted. So far, the outlook is grim for next weekend too with cold weather again. So I might just be sanding again next weekend too. Oh, well, I needed an excuse to sit my ass down and sand that damn plastic. I so can't wait for this interior to be done so i can finally move onto the suspension work. All this sanding is driving me crazy alittle and killing my damn wrist. As so as I have good mixing climate and the fiberglass, I'll get cracking. It souldn't take long at all to glass it all. Probably a weekend or so. The strech fabric is straight and accurate so the bondo phase should be quick and not as intensive as the last box where I used T-shirt to explain to all of you why you shouldn't use it. That working example, warped like a bitch and was intense as hell on the bondo work to straightedn and level the surfaces.

Ahh, the thingsI do for you guys, From here on out, you guys should have all your lessons on why to use spandex, so I shouldn't have to use T-shirt again for you guys to show you its warping.

[Chappy316]

oh, please help this man... page 4

http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f30/ssmuff-doing-a-1st-gen-200-start-206770/

[JACKEL]

Quote: Originally Posted by Chappy316

oh, please help this man... page 4

http://www.s10forum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=206770

yeah, he contacted me through pm. I'll be walking him through it. Good looking out Chap, he was on the road to disaster.

[blt 2 drg]

yo fellow members im lookin for a movie thread that was posted on here a couple a weeks ago that showed a blue or teal take ur pick 1st gen draggin hoppin and what not if anyone knows what im talkin bout shoot me a pm on where on here i can find it .....any help is appreciated out!

[JACKEL]

Quote: Originally Posted by blt 2 drg

yo fellow members im lookin for a movie thread that was posted on here a couple a weeks ago that showed a blue or teal take ur pick 1st gen draggin hoppin and what not if anyone knows what im talkin bout shoot me a pm on where on here i can find it .....any help is appreciated out!

This video I did a while back. Not sure if this is what you're talking about.
I used about 120 different video clips from different videos and cropped them down to a 3 minute or so video to music by Korn. I shot some footage of fire and found clips of an A-bomb explosion to give it a little more dramatic of a feel.

I think the 1st gen you're talking about is in the last 20 seconds of it. Really quick shot of it.

http://www.filecabi.net/u.php?file=1138127300.wmv

[JACKEL]

Is the forum home page and the forum in general acting weird for anyone else or is it just me. Home page looks all screwed up and for a week there the wrong TOTM was on the page. Now when I try to access the forums, It say member not registered but I still have my PM's. I had to access this thread through the search option.

Anyone?

[Chappy316]

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

Is the forum home page and the forum in general acting weird for anyone else or is it just me. Home page looks all screwed up and for a week there the wrong TOTM was on the page. Now when I try to access the forums, It say member not registered but I still have my PM's. I had to access this thread through the search option.

Anyone?

im not totally sure whats going on but they are obviously fixing things as they go. i wasnt SUPER fond of the new setup of everything but its begining to grow on me every day and once its finished im sure it will be alot cooler then it used to be...

[JACKEL]

Quote: Originally Posted by Chappy316

im not totally sure whats going on but they are obviously fixing things as they go. i wasnt SUPER fond of the new setup of everything but its begining to grow on me every day and once its finished im sure it will be alot cooler then it used to be...

All right. I was worried my computer was having diahria (spelling)

[Chappy316]

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

All right. I was worried my computer was having diahria (spelling)

if it is then you gave it to mine at school, home, and my hangout while im at school so... sounds like you owe me a bottle of pepto with that speaker box

[JACKEL]

Quote: Originally Posted by Chappy316

if it is then you gave it to mine at school, home, and my hangout while im at school so... sounds like you owe me a bottle of pepto with that speaker box

I got the glass in finally. If this weekend is decent, I'll start it and have some updates by next monday.

[Chappy316]

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

I got the glass in finally. If this weekend is decent, I'll start it and have some updates by next monday.

[zeldalord]

Yay!

[JACKEL]

Well, I just checked the Weather Channel for the next two weekends and it looks dismal. St. Louis is supposed to be in the 40s the next two weekends. Thats too borderline of my preference for mixing batches when its cold. Of course, unless I feel like counting out 400 drops per 3oz batch.
Unless by sheer luck it warms up, I'll be sanding the plastcis and getting them ready.

On another note. I got the fiberglass and took a look at it. Its good quality glass with the 3oz glass being a tight woven cloth but very soft and plyable meaning, the last layer of glass to go on should be really smooth which eliminates a crazy ass load of bondo and sanding. These items should go together better.

I think I'll have a friend of mine shoot video while I do it to so i can show you all how I'll do something as large as this sub box.

With fiberglassing you have to be patient, even if that means being patient with the weather.

It sucks though.

[Chappy316]

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

I think I'll have a friend of mine shoot video while I do it to so i can show you all how I'll do something as large as this sub box.

get a nice hi-res version and if you need a place to host it let me know. i hate when people post a video to show something and its all nasty and hard to see stuff in it.

[zeldalord]

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

I think I'll have a friend of mine shoot video while I do it to so i can show you all how I'll do something as large as this sub box.

With fiberglassing you have to be patient, even if that means being patient with the weather.

It sucks though.

let me know if you need video editing and compressing, i got the hookup on video editing software.

[zeldalord]

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

With fiberglassing you have to be patient, even if that means being patient with the weather.

It sucks though.

your telling me?!

i've got 3 projects on hold because of the weather!!!

[x00]

so is this thing done yet? lol

[JACKEL]

Like I mentioned a post or two ago, the weather here is too cold for mixing batches of resin.

It was actually 60* yesterday so I was able to resin coat the console. Hopefully if its nice this weekend then I'll have some hardcore fiberglassing going on.

Got to be patient. Rushing stuff leads to disaster. I've already invested enough time, money and effort into these parts. I'm not going to screw them up.

Fiberglassing them should take about a weekend.

On another note, I did get all the glass from U.S. Composites. Not bad stuff, I'm impressed and they rolled it like I requested.

[JACKEL]

Chappy, you coming this weekend still?

[Chappy316]

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

Chappy, you coming this weekend still?

doesnt look like it

but the plan is still soon... i need to get out there so i can get that thing out of your way...

[JACKEL]

Quote: Originally Posted by Chappy316

doesnt look like it

but the plan is still soon... i need to get out there so i can get that thing out of your way...

Thats cool. Let me know when.

[JACKEL]

Updates, Updates, Updates (Here you all go)

Before I get started, please read the following:

I recieve numerous e-mails, AIM messages and Pm's per day regarding the topics of fiberglassing, on average of 25-30 per day. I wrote this thread and displayed the techniques that I felt could be done by the common man with little knowledge of glassing so that even those less experienced can acomplish great things with a little bit of guidance. I try to be as detailed in both my explainations of whats going on and the photos to support thos explainations.

However, 95% of these questions I recieve are duplicate questions. 99-100% of the answers are already explained within this thread or have been performed for you as a direct go by for showing you.

I encourage those with questions to feel free to ask them, But I highly encourage you to read this thread (all pages, I know its getting long) as many of your questions have been addressed.

I probably recieve 15 questions a day alone about screens in the dash and how to mount them; after I have already shown 2 methods reverse mounting and front mounting.

Hint: Many of the items completed for the 98+ dash can be applied in the exact same way to the younger generation and year dashes with obvious small changes to incorporate into those dash configurations.

**Disclaimer**
Some of the glassing techniques explained are for more advanced fiberglassing individuals. Those individuals know their ability based on their experience and the ype of shapes they have been required to cover. ONLY YOU, can be your own best judge as to whether you are capable of doing your work.

If you are inexperienced, then I HIGHLY ENCOURAGE you to design skeleton based objects where you know the radius of the curves on it are not going to be extreme. i.e. my new console build is definately not for a new-bie.

Fiberglassing can be explained and taught and drilled into the heads of others but in reality, it all boils down to experience, as with most things in life. You experience is truely what teaches you.

BUT, the only way to get experience is to try. It is a learned craft like Welding. You don't just buy a welder, and start doing a body drop if your new to welding. No, you practice on scrap metal. Same holds true for fiberglassing. Practice on small projects and progressively make them more difficult.

Lastly, IF YOU READ THIS ENTIRE THREAD AND YOU STILL USE FLEECE, I'll Shun you after I stick my arm through the computer screen and slap you.

NEVER USE FLEECE, you'll know why if you read the thread.

[BIGGERISBETTER]

werd..

[JACKEL]

Updates:

**Weather was decent so I laid the initial layer of glass**

I'll be starting with the Center Console. It is going to be the most difficult and I generally try to get the hardest stuff out of the way first, so I cruise through the rest of the stuff.

I will be doing two different techniques for this center console over the next couple of update posts.

Relief Cutting and Striping

Relief Cutting- When you have serious curves to accomplish this technique comes in handy. I covered it briefly with the dash pods but its more in depth here in this post.

Striping - Some times, even relief cutting doesn't always help. So, cutting your glass into 1" , 2" and 3" strips and laying these over the object helps. The problems with striping is that it is time consuming and slow as you have to lay strip after strip.

In both case the object of the game is to get as much over all area covered, however, in both cases you will get over lap of the material. The over lap is fine. Any area not covered can be patched in later so that the ply of strength is through out the layer and not broken up. Think of striping as mumifying the object.

**Disclaimer**(my own cya policy)
These are more advanced techniques for those with more experience than others.

This center console has many convex and concave curves to it, so if your item is as curvy as this console, and you're inexperienced, practice before you start or you'll waste time and money on fiberglass supplies. Curves of this center console are definately not for the beginner.

Refielf Cutting

1st, if you order from places like Wicks or U.S. Composites, this is how you're glass will arrive, all rolloed up. This is preferred as folding the glass can cause creases that you'll eventaully have to fight with.

From left to right, the order of glass weight is as: 7.5oz, 6oz, 4oz, 3oz



From right to left, the order of ounce weight glass is as: 7.5oz, 6oz, 4oz, 3oz
(You can see the correlation of thread width and tightness of weave)


You always want to start with the heaviest fabric first. In this case being the 7.5oz glass

In this picture of the console, this is the front end right under the dash. The object of reliefe cutting is to make as few cuts as needed. So, your first step is to lay the glass over the object and try to get it flat with all surfaces prior to resin ever going on. Fold the glass up into a Pinch like shown in the photo to help you accomplish this. Thei Pinch is what will be cut out.

Don't be afraid to use a majic marker and write on the glass. You're not going to hurt it. Here, you can see that I found already, 1 large Pinch at the front of the console and have marked its crease.



Now I cut this Pinch out so that I can progress on with laying the glass as flat as possible searching for another pinch.



For a console such as this and the majority of the curve being in-line (directly down the middle of the console) AND, I know that I had a big pinch at the front, it can be easily deducted that I'll more than likely have another huge Pinch in the rear. Which I did.

This shows the rear of the console. Cutting this much area is going to make two large flaps in the rear. I'm going to try and over lay these two flaps slightly when I lay them permanently to make a seam right down the middle. The dotten line shows where the curve of the console is, the solid line shows where and the amount I want to overlap.



Next, mark all of your blatant flat areas of interest. i.e. the guage face and the switch panel and (in case your curious, also the ridge between the guage face and the switch panel.



Then, from these lines pie cut the rest of the glass that hangs from these points. as seen in the last picture. Make sure you have sharp sheers so you don't start dethreading the glass.

Cut along these lines. Once you cut them, you'll notice a drastic improvement in the glass's performance and its ability to follow lines.



Mark the lengths of fiberglass after laying each strip (with out resin) to see their natural direction of lay. Then cut the access off.



Once everything is cut is when you'll really see improvement in the glass's ability to conform.



****Remember**** You have marked the lines of the glass around the switch box and guages. These are your reference points for laying the glass. Removing the glass at this point will throw everything off and is likely to end in disaster. So, DO NOT REMOVE the glass.

Also, you may ask: What about all that area in orange that not covered? Well, save the scraps from your cut Pinches and access. You'll cut these into smaller patches to patch up these areas.

Access glass



To apply the resin, we willl start with one side, get it all squared away and then do the other side. To apply the resin, fold these flaps over the top and tuck your resin filled brush under the glass and apply it to the area of the side you're working with.



Then, one by one, fold these flaps down and start working them over the area they naturally fold to.

This is a pic of these flaps folded down and resined.



This pic shows the smaller patches cut and applied. (I didn't resin them at this point so you could still see the patch) They were resin after this photo.



And thats how you do it. 1st stage completed. With glassing, each layer is called a stage. 1st stage is never pretty. it gets better looking as you go. But, next to do after the resin cures is trim off the access, give is a little sanding with 220 grit and repeat the whole thing. However, next Update will be with striping.

[x00]

mmm....thats what i have been doing all this time and always thought there was an easier way.... i kept waiting and waiting on you do do it and show some magical way but i guess i was doing it right all along...

looks good

[JACKEL]

Quote: Originally Posted by x00

mmm....thats what i have been doing all this time and always thought there was an easier way.... i kept waiting and waiting on you do do it and show some magical way but i guess i was doing it right all along...

looks good

Well, you might be a little more advanced than the others. Good on you. It really boils down to common sense and not really majic. The Striping is another method too that I'll show later.

PM me some pics of your work. I'm curious.

[BIGGERISBETTER]

looks like a bitch!

[zeldalord]

Rock'n!!

[JACKEL]

Quote: Originally Posted by BIGGERISBETTER

looks like a bitch!

Ahh, Yeah, that aint no lie. I laid the glass for an hour. Well, i guess I still fought it a little cause when I went to bed, I CRASHED. Freak'n glassing wore my ass out.

Update:

I'm a dumbass.....I did the striping yesterday, took all these pics and forgot to bring the dig-cam memory card to work with me. I'll uplaod them hopefully this weekend.

Tech Update:

You don't have to do both relief cutting and striping on the same item. I only did that to show you guys a little better what I had talked about earlier in the thread about relief cutting with tha dash pods.

When I did the striping, I cut the strips into 2" wide strips. Stage 2 went a lot quicker and looked better. So, we can now deducted that in cases of extreme curves (which I'd say we had here, striping is the way to go).

One thing I forget to mention ealier about striping. If you cut the glass across is Direction (Direction = its intended ply strength. i.e. Uni-direction has strength in 2 directions and minimal strength in the other 2; Bi-Directional has a 75 - 25 strength where 75% of the strngth runs north and south and the 25% runs east and west.) If you cut across the 75% direction you can then eaqually manipulate the glass in all directions rather than bias to one. Because of that, you can lay the glass and make it curve on a flat surface like a road going around a bend.

When you stripe- the object of the game again is to get maximum coverage of the item. It is best to over lay the glass.

BUT (Big Tip)

If you plan your placement of these strips properly, you can over lap stipe at 45* angles, making sort of a checkered pattern if you will on the item.

Benefits: Striping the fiberglass at 45* angles creates many many over lays of fiberglass in sort of a web pattern. In a sence you can make 1 coating of fiberglass as though it were many layers. The strngth is enormous as the strength is dispersed for the most part, evenly through out the web.

This is how I did the console the second layer. Its so damn strong I layed it on the floor, put my hands on it and did push-up on it.

So, Technically, there are only two layers of glass on there. But, the striping is acting like 4 layers in itself. So we can now say that 5 layers are on the console. Which is more than enough. On to bondo, which I started already.

[pewter_dime_99]

can't wait to see some pics man

[zeldalord]

hey nick, got all my glassing supplies finally... going to start the sub box when the weather permits. The temp right now is about 58 degrees alittle too cold so i'm waiting.

still trying to figure out how the heck i'm going to install the damn terminals though.

[Milky4204]

Quote: Originally Posted by zeldalord

The temp right now is about 58 degrees alittle too cold so i'm waiting.

too cold. 58 sounds about right, let it sit out in the sun for a while and your good to go. progress is lookin good nick. I've started on my center console. got my fabric stretched and just need to thro some glass over it.

[zeldalord]

haha take this bitches!

bought a 16 yard bolt of spandex from walmart for 15.00!!!

OWNED!!

[Slappy McNasty]

Quote: Originally Posted by zeldalord

haha take this bitches!

bought a 16 yard bolt of spandex from walmart for 15.00!!!

OWNED!!

now you can glass yer whole fukkin truck, bumper 2 bumper