Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two)

ThorRacing01 · 02-06-2006, 12:23 PM

yeah that stuff is crazy quick i went out yesterday and picked up some of that stuff along with some other stuff to do my fiberglass project. The only real question is how safe is it to be running your fingers over it like that?

NickZigaitis · 02-06-2006, 12:42 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by ThorRacing01

yeah that stuff is crazy quick i went out yesterday and picked up some of that stuff along with some other stuff to do my fiberglass project. The only real question is how safe is it to be running your fingers over it like that?

You can do that but you better do it with minimal pressure and quickly. DO NOT stop for even a second when doing that or your hand is glued to the surface, lol.

zeldalord · 02-06-2006, 01:47 PM

thats where i was thinking about putting the terminals, they are not cup style.

the amp, uh not sure where i'm going to mount it rly, figure it out later just wana get the box done first.

Phillly · 02-07-2006, 04:40 AM

I like it, you have changed my fleece ways, Go Spandex!

NickZigaitis · 02-07-2006, 08:13 AM

FYI Update:

I was PM's a question about Micro Balloons or Filler to thicken up the epoxy so it can be used as a filler.

Here was my response. Hopefully you'll find it to be good info.

You'll mix a 1:1 of Epoxy Base to Epoxy Hardner. If you are working in a cold environment like in your garage thats unheated, you might need to change the ratio to a 1.25 to 1.5:1 (More Hardner to Base). You want Microballoons. After you mix your epoxy batch, add the microballoons. You'll just have to get a feel for how the microballoons thickens the epoxy. Keep adding more microballoons to your batch till it the desired thickness. The epoxy and microbaloons mix can be used for filling, creating gussets, or making a sandable surface with epoxy.

Here is what I do. On a flat piece of cardboard or flat piece of scrap wood, such as plywood or particle board when you're making you sub box, pour out enough base to make a half-dollar size circle. Then, beside that circle (without the two circles touching), make another half-dollar size circle of hardner. Based on the temperature you're working in you might need to make a circle of hardner slightly bigger than the circle of base. Doing this gives you a rough guess-timate of the ratio without using measuring cups. Then, cover the two circles in the microballoons powder and start neading the two circles together. Continue to add more microballoons to the batch to thicken it up.

Another trick, if you're working in low temp areas is to heat the epoxy up. Because the epoxy Parts are cold, they run like molasace. To make them run quicker, get a cup of hot water and set the bottles in it for about 10 minutes. Take the bottles out and dry them off, then start the above process. The epoxy will now run like syrup and be easier to work with.

However, one thing to note is that because the epoxy is warm, it will cure quicker. In the event that you have warmed the bottles, it is recommended that you mix an even 1:1 batch to control your work time.

Another thing to mention is that in low temps the microballoons most likely won't cause the cure to quicken, but in high temps, the epoxy will cure quickly, and with microballoons, even quicker. Epoxy as well as resin tend to cure quickly if large batches are made up.

To save your epoxy resource, or if all you need is a small amount, the use of a small measuring cup such as a 1oz cup like what you find with cough syrup medicines will work.

If you use a small measuring cup like this, fill the base up to the 1/2oz mark, then, in the same cup, the hardner to the 1oz line. That will be a 1:1 mix. Hardner, anywhere above the 1oz line will make the 1.25 or 1.5:1 ratios. Then you could mix in your balloons.

Microbaloons can also be used with polyester resins.

NickZigaitis · 02-08-2006, 12:35 PM

The original dash constructed in this thread is back up for sale. The buyer has fallen through after months of waiting to complete the sale.

Please check out the ad and PM me only if you have a serious offer. Thanks

Link to Ad:
http://www.s10forum.com/classifieds/...1&cat=4&page=1

Kenny_Cox · 02-08-2006, 01:37 PM

Man i feel like an @$$hole lol, Nick asked me to put some pictures in here when i finally got it installed, the console that is, This is the only picture i have as of right now. The glare on it makes the paint look like POOP, but i assure you nick i didnt F*** it up, it looks amazing in there!! thanks for the GREAT work!

NickZigaitis · 02-08-2006, 01:45 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by tukn18s

Man i feel like an @$$hole lol, Nick asked me to put some pictures in here when i finally got it installed, the console that is, This is the only picture i have as of right now. The glare on it makes the paint look like POOP, but i assure you nick i didnt F*** it up, it looks amazing in there!! thanks for the GREAT work!

Now thats what the fvck I'm talking about. Looks great bro. Glad I could help you out. Its really did turn out awesome like I promised you it would.

BIGGERISBETTER · 02-08-2006, 01:56 PM

looks good dood. Its too bad ive got a 95 too.. id like to have that dash bezel..

Hows the rest of the stuff comin along fella?

NickZigaitis · 02-08-2006, 02:46 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by BIGGERISBETTER

looks good dood. Its too bad ive got a 95 too.. id like to have that dash bezel..

Hows the rest of the stuff comin along fella?

Wellllll, The brakes got smalled on cause I'm out a $$$$$ right now because the f-'n sale of the dash isn't complete yet after 2 1/2 months. Its still available. Shit, I'll sell the damn thing for $250 + shipping if someone would take it. I'm a little shocked that no one is jumping on it already considering the f-'n 1000 pm's and e-mails I get about it or how to do it.

Sorry, Just a bit anoyed right now.

BIGGERISBETTER · 02-08-2006, 03:04 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

Wellllll, The brakes got smalled on cause I'm out a $$$$$ right now because the f-'n sale of the dash isn't complete yet after 2 1/2 months. Its still available. Shit, I'll sell the damn thing for $250 + shipping if someone would take it. I'm a little shocked that no one is jumping on it already considering the f-'n 1000 pm's and e-mails I get about it or how to do it.

Sorry, Just a bit anoyed right now.

heh'.. its understandable. You have been gettin the shaft lately w/ trying to be a good guy and hook ppl up. Id be mad too. But.. at least some are taking your advise to heart and diving into the projects themselves right?

Keep your head up nick.. Alot of us appreciate the effort you dump into this thead.

Chappy316 · 02-08-2006, 03:19 PM

dont worry man, something will work out with it...

and oh yea, SEE YOU THIS WEEKEND!

NickZigaitis · 02-08-2006, 03:46 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by BIGGERISBETTER

heh'.. its understandable. You have been gettin the shaft lately w/ trying to be a good guy and hook ppl up. Id be mad too. But.. at least some are taking your advise to heart and diving into the projects themselves right?

Keep your head up nick.. Alot of us appreciate the effort you dump into this thead.

I sure appraciate it. And, I sure hope the thread is appreciated. It would be so much easier to just blast right through a project rather than stopping all the time to take photos and notes of what I did to get something out-a nothing.

Thanks

Oh, by the way. I went to that kid's house a got my money. He tried giving me the run around but I gave him the legal jargan and he woke right up. Long story short, his dad wrote me a check. I'll be his dad rode his ass hard. I sure know my dad would have if I were that kid.

NickZigaitis · 02-08-2006, 03:48 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Chappy316

dont worry man, something will work out with it...

and oh yea, SEE YOU THIS WEEKEND!

Damn dude, I thought you were going to be here last weekend for some reason. Whats the scoop. You're coming from Ohio and going where? and passing through St. Louis. I might need to meet you when you're on your way back through on like Sunday. Sorry bro, got my weekends mixed up with all the baby comotion lately.

Call me as soon as you're in town. 314-550-1437, my name is Nick, lol. Like you all haven't figured that one out yet.

BIGGERISBETTER · 02-08-2006, 03:58 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

Damn dude, I thought you were going to be here last weekend for some reason. Whats the scoop. You're coming from Ohio and going where? and passing through St. Louis. I might need to meet you when you're on your way back through on like Sunday. Sorry bro, got my weekends mixed up with all the baby comotion lately.

Call me as soon as you're in town. 314-550-1437, my name is Nick, lol. Like you all haven't figured that one out yet.

I think they are taking dragginbody's blazer to indiana and then going your way to pick up that box.

Chappy316 · 02-08-2006, 04:08 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

Damn dude, I thought you were going to be here last weekend for some reason. Whats the scoop. You're coming from Ohio and going where? and passing through St. Louis. I might need to meet you when you're on your way back through on like Sunday. Sorry bro, got my weekends mixed up with all the baby comotion lately.

Call me as soon as you're in town. 314-550-1437, my name is Nick, lol. Like you all haven't figured that one out yet.

yea this weekend. we are leaving north central ohio (aka Elyria) about 1130 or 12 tomorrow, thursday, morning/afternoon and heading 7 hours south west. i think we are shooting to be back here around like mid-day saturday so we wont be out there too long... since our buddy Kris (DragginBody) got a job with Jason at Suicide Doors he had to leave his project blazer behind. now that he has settled in and has a place for it Anthony (Drps10) and i are taking it to him... i think anthony said we are like 3 hours northish of you so if you want i can call you tomorrow once im on the road and we can figure something out or whatever... let me know.

Quote: Originally Posted by BIGGERISBETTER

I think they are taking dragginbody's blazer to indiana and then going your way to pick up that box.

you coming or what? lol

BIGGERISBETTER · 02-08-2006, 04:10 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Chappy316

yea this weekend. we are leaving north central ohio (aka Elyria) about 1130 or 12 tomorrow, thursday, morning/afternoon and heading 7 hours south west. i think we are shooting to be back here around like mid-day saturday so we wont be out there too long... since our buddy Kris (DragginBody) got a job with Jason at Suicide Doors he had to leave his project blazer behind. now that he has settled in and has a place for it Anthony (Drps10) and i are taking it to him... i think anthony said we are like 3 hours northish of you so if you want i can call you tomorrow once im on the road and we can figure something out or whatever... let me know.

you coming or what? lol

Wanted too.. but i told ya i had family shit to do .. the grandma wants a family picture

Chappy316 · 02-08-2006, 04:14 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by BIGGERISBETTER

Wanted too.. but i told ya i had family shit to do .. the grandma wants a family picture

tell her to take the picture and you will crop yourself in later in photoshop!

Chappy316 · 02-08-2006, 04:15 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

Damn dude, I thought you were going to be here last weekend for some reason. Whats the scoop. You're coming from Ohio and going where? and passing through St. Louis. I might need to meet you when you're on your way back through on like Sunday. Sorry bro, got my weekends mixed up with all the baby comotion lately.

Call me as soon as you're in town. 314-550-1437, my name is Nick, lol. Like you all haven't figured that one out yet.

im gonna throw you in my phone book now, i assume thats your cell phone number?

x00 · 02-08-2006, 06:46 PM

hey..can you post up pics of the speaker pods you made? i found the thread you posted them in, but you used the s10forum garage to host them and that doesn't seem to work anymore..thanks

NickZigaitis · 02-08-2006, 08:29 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by x00

hey..can you post up pics of the speaker pods you made? i found the thread you posted them in, but you used the s10forum garage to host them and that doesn't seem to work anymore..thanks

I'll post them tomorrow.

NickZigaitis · 02-09-2006, 01:47 PM

By popular demand

Update:

I'm going to explain two methods here. One being the tried and true spandex strech fabric method and the other being the "Sagging" method with relief cutting.

At the end, I'll have a contest as to who can tell me which is which.

One speaker pod is the strech fabric, the other is the Sagging. Whoever guess correctly gets a pat on the back for paying attention and having a good eye.

I'll warn you. You better have a damn good eye.

First I'll explain the Strech fabric way of life. 1st off, you'll never ever be able to do this with fleece. Long story short, the fleece is too thick to wrap the edges and still make the pod fit into the original factory hole in the dash. Hell, the spandex made it a snugger-than-stock fit, so good luck with those hardheaded folks and their fleece.

1st, you need to construct a cardboard model to develope the appropriate angle of the speakers for your soundstage (PunkORama, lol, jk). I have mine angled 7* up-plane and 15* toward centerline.

Now, this will only work if your speaker selected is small enough to fit in this area and still have enough room to create a smooth transition from speaker edge to grill edge. In my case, I chose Audiobahn speakers with detachable tweets. I likes the bullet shaped cone in the middle of the speaker so I mounted the tweet seperate from the speaker to highlight this bullet shapped cone.

2nd, you need to lay a single layer of glass over the plastic grill. This is to create a flat surface to work with, aside from those pesky tiny holes for the sound.

3rd, Cut a hole in the oem grill large enough to get your speaker through since the speakers will be mounted underneath to studs (much like in the TV dash install first posted in this thread). Construct the platform out of this 1/8" thick plywood and 1/4" x 1x4" square plywood stick. You can use hotglue here to make your platform but I chose to use epoxy for strength sake. Cut the hole in the platform and place the speaker in the hole so you can do your final sizing of that hole and also mark the location for the mounting studs.
After you have marked the stud locations, drill a small hole and screw in a 1" metric thread screw from the top. Screw it in only a 1/4" so that there are threads exposed on both sides. On the threads of the top side, apply epoxy to the threads and then screw it in another 1/4" so that roughly a 1/2" of thread is exposed from underneath. After the epoxy has cured, use a dremel and cut the screw head and remaining threads flush with the topside of the plywood platform.

(Sorry, No Pics of that, this was done last summer)

4th, Suspend your new pod off the work bench by placing it on top of a small box. Apply your resin and strech the hell out of the fabric over the pod and tack the extra cloth to the bench as seen numerous times before in this thread. Then apply resin to the topside of the stretched fabric.

5th, trim the access off and lay 4 layers of 1/2oz glass. Thats all you need. Then do your bondo and surface prep work for paint.

Now for sagging and relief cutting glass (The substitute for strech fabric)

Sagging is a method of streching fiberglass between two points of interest without the use of strech fabric. It is a way of sagging the glass between these two points to create a valey between them. Sometimes, the valley between these two points will be eliminated after pulling on the strech fabric, which is why this method comes in handy sometimes.

Couple things to note here:

1) You MUST USE WEAVE CLOTHE FIBERGLASS, no matte shit here.
2) You Must have your head out of your butt and watch the glass as it is curing. Meaning, you must watch it from wet to dry and constantly adjust it. I'll explain.......

With strech fabric, it is taught and not going anywhere. This sagging, the fabric can't be secured so it constantly moving until that sudden, "pop, its holding to the surface". Again, I'll explain...........

Polyester resin is a chemical reaction like epoxy. However, polyester resin also produce something more so than that of epoxy,........Heat.

Because the resin is heating up as it cures, its also shrinking. Here is why we use Weave Clothe over Matte.

Because weave is threaded strands of fiberglass, these threads and the spacing between them, expand and contract. The expansion and contraction of the weave glass is why is conformes much better to tighter curves than matte. Matte glass is like spagetti mashed together. because of this, the matte glass can't expand or contract which is why its crap for conforming to curves. This shrinking is also why Spandex is preferred over that of T-Shirt. T-shirt is made primarily of cottom. We all know that cotton is suseptible to shrinking from heat and why your small Chow dog can wear your shirt after you was on hot and dry on hot, lol. When the T-shirt, saturated with resin is used, you are more likely to see warping after it is cured. Correcting the warp is a whole other conversation.

Because the glass is unsecured and basically floating, as the resin shrinks, its pulling on the glass and drawing the threads of the weave, closer together which is why its moving. This movement is also why you need to constantly watch it and adjust it as it cures to maintain the desired spade of the valley and save yourself bondo time.

Relief Cutting

Sometimes, even the toughest curves get the better of Weave Glass. So reliefe cuting it and overlapping the cut pie sections will help you conquer a curve.

Here is how you do it. lay the glass over the item. Identify the apex of the curve and draw lines on the fiberglass in even segments from the curve. Using sharp sheers only (no shitty scissors here, you'll sprawl the glass). Basically, the area of glass hanging past the curved apex will get pie cut.

As you apply the resin, start at one side of these pie cuts and lay each one down individually. They should overlay slightly in shallower curves and more so in tighter curves.

Lay down your 1st layer of glass an constantly monitor it and adjust it as it cures to maintain the desired curve. Once this first layer of glass is cured, in essence, its like your strech fabric and can now be used as a more solid basis for additional layers. Again, you'll have to relief cut each additional layer.

The next series of pictures shows the sagging (no strech fabric) and if you look closely, you'll see the reliefe cuts and where they overlap.

Then do your Bondo work, glazing of pin holes, prime and paint.

And the final product.

Try and tell me which is which. Which one was Sagged, and which one of Strech Fabric laid?

Driver Side?

or Passenger side?

Sagging is more involved and intensive but a good solution where strech fabric isn't.

And, Thats how its done.

Chappy316 · 02-09-2006, 02:07 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis

based on this picture i would say the drivers side was stretch fabric because it looks dark blue in there... once they are bondo'd and painted you cant tell i dont think...

and i like how you mounted them from below and how they came out flush on top, very pimp!

NickZigaitis · 02-09-2006, 02:27 PM

And the Winner is .....

Not Chappy316.

The driver side was the pod made using the Sagging technique.

Thanks for playing the "Pic the Pod Contest"

lol!!! I love fooling you guys.

NickZigaitis · 02-09-2006, 02:29 PM

Remember. Pay attention to the pics, everything about them.

Notice the placement of the tweeter. That should have given it away.

BIGGERISBETTER · 02-09-2006, 03:00 PM

NickZigaitis · 02-09-2006, 03:06 PM

02-06-2006, 12:23 PM	#351
ThorRacing01 Registered User Age: 25 Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,401 Location: newport news,va User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) yeah that stuff is crazy quick i went out yesterday and picked up some of that stuff along with some other stuff to do my fiberglass project. The only real question is how safe is it to be running your fingers over it like that?
	[Reply w/Quote]

02-06-2006, 12:42 PM	#352
NickZigaitis I Like Fire....HaHaHa Age: 78 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,693 Location: God Damn Garage, STL User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by ThorRacing01 yeah that stuff is crazy quick i went out yesterday and picked up some of that stuff along with some other stuff to do my fiberglass project. The only real question is how safe is it to be running your fingers over it like that? You can do that but you better do it with minimal pressure and quickly. DO NOT stop for even a second when doing that or your hand is glued to the surface, lol.
	[Reply w/Quote]

02-06-2006, 01:47 PM	#353
zeldalord Cornerin Demon Age: 24 Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 2,139 Location: Little Rock User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) thats where i was thinking about putting the terminals, they are not cup style. the amp, uh not sure where i'm going to mount it rly, figure it out later just wana get the box done first.
	[Reply w/Quote]

02-07-2006, 04:40 AM	#354
Phillly Fear My Stupidity Age: 26 Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 1,300 Location: DFW, TX User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) I like it, you have changed my fleece ways, Go Spandex!
	[Reply w/Quote]

02-07-2006, 08:13 AM	#355
NickZigaitis I Like Fire....HaHaHa Age: 78 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,693 Location: God Damn Garage, STL User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) FYI Update: I was PM's a question about Micro Balloons or Filler to thicken up the epoxy so it can be used as a filler. Here was my response. Hopefully you'll find it to be good info. You'll mix a 1:1 of Epoxy Base to Epoxy Hardner. If you are working in a cold environment like in your garage thats unheated, you might need to change the ratio to a 1.25 to 1.5:1 (More Hardner to Base). You want Microballoons. After you mix your epoxy batch, add the microballoons. You'll just have to get a feel for how the microballoons thickens the epoxy. Keep adding more microballoons to your batch till it the desired thickness. The epoxy and microbaloons mix can be used for filling, creating gussets, or making a sandable surface with epoxy. Here is what I do. On a flat piece of cardboard or flat piece of scrap wood, such as plywood or particle board when you're making you sub box, pour out enough base to make a half-dollar size circle. Then, beside that circle (without the two circles touching), make another half-dollar size circle of hardner. Based on the temperature you're working in you might need to make a circle of hardner slightly bigger than the circle of base. Doing this gives you a rough guess-timate of the ratio without using measuring cups. Then, cover the two circles in the microballoons powder and start neading the two circles together. Continue to add more microballoons to the batch to thicken it up. Another trick, if you're working in low temp areas is to heat the epoxy up. Because the epoxy Parts are cold, they run like molasace. To make them run quicker, get a cup of hot water and set the bottles in it for about 10 minutes. Take the bottles out and dry them off, then start the above process. The epoxy will now run like syrup and be easier to work with. However, one thing to note is that because the epoxy is warm, it will cure quicker. In the event that you have warmed the bottles, it is recommended that you mix an even 1:1 batch to control your work time. Another thing to mention is that in low temps the microballoons most likely won't cause the cure to quicken, but in high temps, the epoxy will cure quickly, and with microballoons, even quicker. Epoxy as well as resin tend to cure quickly if large batches are made up. To save your epoxy resource, or if all you need is a small amount, the use of a small measuring cup such as a 1oz cup like what you find with cough syrup medicines will work. If you use a small measuring cup like this, fill the base up to the 1/2oz mark, then, in the same cup, the hardner to the 1oz line. That will be a 1:1 mix. Hardner, anywhere above the 1oz line will make the 1.25 or 1.5:1 ratios. Then you could mix in your balloons. Microbaloons can also be used with polyester resins.
	[Reply w/Quote]


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02-08-2006, 12:35 PM	#356
NickZigaitis I Like Fire....HaHaHa Age: 78 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,693 Location: God Damn Garage, STL User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) The original dash constructed in this thread is back up for sale. The buyer has fallen through after months of waiting to complete the sale. Please check out the ad and PM me only if you have a serious offer. Thanks Link to Ad: http://www.s10forum.com/classifieds/...1&cat=4&page=1
	[Reply w/Quote]

02-08-2006, 01:37 PM	#357
Kenny_Cox BodyDropped Member Age: 21 Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 2,338 Location: HOLT, Michigan User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Man i feel like an @$$hole lol, Nick asked me to put some pictures in here when i finally got it installed, the console that is, This is the only picture i have as of right now. The glare on it makes the paint look like POOP, but i assure you nick i didnt F*** it up, it looks amazing in there!! thanks for the GREAT work!
	[Reply w/Quote]

02-08-2006, 01:45 PM	#358
NickZigaitis I Like Fire....HaHaHa Age: 78 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,693 Location: God Damn Garage, STL User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by tukn18s Man i feel like an @$$hole lol, Nick asked me to put some pictures in here when i finally got it installed, the console that is, This is the only picture i have as of right now. The glare on it makes the paint look like POOP, but i assure you nick i didnt F*** it up, it looks amazing in there!! thanks for the GREAT work! Now thats what the fvck I'm talking about. Looks great bro. Glad I could help you out. Its really did turn out awesome like I promised you it would.
	[Reply w/Quote]

02-08-2006, 01:56 PM	#359
BIGGERISBETTER flat blue and layin frame Age: 24 Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 5,885 Location: Bolivar, Ohio User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) looks good dood. Its too bad ive got a 95 too.. id like to have that dash bezel.. Hows the rest of the stuff comin along fella?
	[Reply w/Quote]

02-08-2006, 02:46 PM	#360
NickZigaitis I Like Fire....HaHaHa Age: 78 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,693 Location: God Damn Garage, STL User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by BIGGERISBETTER looks good dood. Its too bad ive got a 95 too.. id like to have that dash bezel.. Hows the rest of the stuff comin along fella? Wellllll, The brakes got smalled on cause I'm out a $$$$$ right now because the f-'n sale of the dash isn't complete yet after 2 1/2 months. Its still available. Shit, I'll sell the damn thing for $250 + shipping if someone would take it. I'm a little shocked that no one is jumping on it already considering the f-'n 1000 pm's and e-mails I get about it or how to do it. Sorry, Just a bit anoyed right now.
	[Reply w/Quote]

02-08-2006, 03:04 PM	#361
BIGGERISBETTER flat blue and layin frame Age: 24 Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 5,885 Location: Bolivar, Ohio User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis Wellllll, The brakes got smalled on cause I'm out a $$$$$ right now because the f-'n sale of the dash isn't complete yet after 2 1/2 months. Its still available. Shit, I'll sell the damn thing for $250 + shipping if someone would take it. I'm a little shocked that no one is jumping on it already considering the f-'n 1000 pm's and e-mails I get about it or how to do it. Sorry, Just a bit anoyed right now. heh'.. its understandable. You have been gettin the shaft lately w/ trying to be a good guy and hook ppl up. Id be mad too. But.. at least some are taking your advise to heart and diving into the projects themselves right? Keep your head up nick.. Alot of us appreciate the effort you dump into this thead.
	[Reply w/Quote]

02-08-2006, 03:19 PM	#362
Chappy316 SOLD! Age: 23 Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 3,892 Location: Cedar Point Ohio User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) dont worry man, something will work out with it... and oh yea, SEE YOU THIS WEEKEND!
	[Reply w/Quote]

02-08-2006, 03:46 PM	#363
NickZigaitis I Like Fire....HaHaHa Age: 78 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,693 Location: God Damn Garage, STL User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by BIGGERISBETTER heh'.. its understandable. You have been gettin the shaft lately w/ trying to be a good guy and hook ppl up. Id be mad too. But.. at least some are taking your advise to heart and diving into the projects themselves right? Keep your head up nick.. Alot of us appreciate the effort you dump into this thead. I sure appraciate it. And, I sure hope the thread is appreciated. It would be so much easier to just blast right through a project rather than stopping all the time to take photos and notes of what I did to get something out-a nothing. Thanks Oh, by the way. I went to that kid's house a got my money. He tried giving me the run around but I gave him the legal jargan and he woke right up. Long story short, his dad wrote me a check. I'll be his dad rode his ass hard. I sure know my dad would have if I were that kid.
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02-08-2006, 03:48 PM	#364
NickZigaitis I Like Fire....HaHaHa Age: 78 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,693 Location: God Damn Garage, STL User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by Chappy316 dont worry man, something will work out with it... and oh yea, SEE YOU THIS WEEKEND! Damn dude, I thought you were going to be here last weekend for some reason. Whats the scoop. You're coming from Ohio and going where? and passing through St. Louis. I might need to meet you when you're on your way back through on like Sunday. Sorry bro, got my weekends mixed up with all the baby comotion lately. Call me as soon as you're in town. 314-550-1437, my name is Nick, lol. Like you all haven't figured that one out yet.
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02-08-2006, 03:58 PM	#365
BIGGERISBETTER flat blue and layin frame Age: 24 Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 5,885 Location: Bolivar, Ohio User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis Damn dude, I thought you were going to be here last weekend for some reason. Whats the scoop. You're coming from Ohio and going where? and passing through St. Louis. I might need to meet you when you're on your way back through on like Sunday. Sorry bro, got my weekends mixed up with all the baby comotion lately. Call me as soon as you're in town. 314-550-1437, my name is Nick, lol. Like you all haven't figured that one out yet. I think they are taking dragginbody's blazer to indiana and then going your way to pick up that box.
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02-08-2006, 04:08 PM	#366
Chappy316 SOLD! Age: 23 Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 3,892 Location: Cedar Point Ohio User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis Damn dude, I thought you were going to be here last weekend for some reason. Whats the scoop. You're coming from Ohio and going where? and passing through St. Louis. I might need to meet you when you're on your way back through on like Sunday. Sorry bro, got my weekends mixed up with all the baby comotion lately. Call me as soon as you're in town. 314-550-1437, my name is Nick, lol. Like you all haven't figured that one out yet. yea this weekend. we are leaving north central ohio (aka Elyria) about 1130 or 12 tomorrow, thursday, morning/afternoon and heading 7 hours south west. i think we are shooting to be back here around like mid-day saturday so we wont be out there too long... since our buddy Kris (DragginBody) got a job with Jason at Suicide Doors he had to leave his project blazer behind. now that he has settled in and has a place for it Anthony (Drps10) and i are taking it to him... i think anthony said we are like 3 hours northish of you so if you want i can call you tomorrow once im on the road and we can figure something out or whatever... let me know. Quote: Originally Posted by BIGGERISBETTER I think they are taking dragginbody's blazer to indiana and then going your way to pick up that box. you coming or what? lol
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02-08-2006, 04:10 PM	#367
BIGGERISBETTER flat blue and layin frame Age: 24 Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 5,885 Location: Bolivar, Ohio User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by Chappy316 yea this weekend. we are leaving north central ohio (aka Elyria) about 1130 or 12 tomorrow, thursday, morning/afternoon and heading 7 hours south west. i think we are shooting to be back here around like mid-day saturday so we wont be out there too long... since our buddy Kris (DragginBody) got a job with Jason at Suicide Doors he had to leave his project blazer behind. now that he has settled in and has a place for it Anthony (Drps10) and i are taking it to him... i think anthony said we are like 3 hours northish of you so if you want i can call you tomorrow once im on the road and we can figure something out or whatever... let me know. you coming or what? lol Wanted too.. but i told ya i had family shit to do .. the grandma wants a family picture
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02-08-2006, 04:14 PM	#368
Chappy316 SOLD! Age: 23 Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 3,892 Location: Cedar Point Ohio User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by BIGGERISBETTER Wanted too.. but i told ya i had family shit to do .. the grandma wants a family picture tell her to take the picture and you will crop yourself in later in photoshop!
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02-08-2006, 04:15 PM	#369
Chappy316 SOLD! Age: 23 Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 3,892 Location: Cedar Point Ohio User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis Damn dude, I thought you were going to be here last weekend for some reason. Whats the scoop. You're coming from Ohio and going where? and passing through St. Louis. I might need to meet you when you're on your way back through on like Sunday. Sorry bro, got my weekends mixed up with all the baby comotion lately. Call me as soon as you're in town. 314-550-1437, my name is Nick, lol. Like you all haven't figured that one out yet. im gonna throw you in my phone book now, i assume thats your cell phone number?
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02-08-2006, 06:46 PM	#370
x00 Got 20's? Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 773 Location: nj User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) hey..can you post up pics of the speaker pods you made? i found the thread you posted them in, but you used the s10forum garage to host them and that doesn't seem to work anymore..thanks
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02-08-2006, 08:29 PM	#371
NickZigaitis I Like Fire....HaHaHa Age: 78 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,693 Location: God Damn Garage, STL User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by x00 hey..can you post up pics of the speaker pods you made? i found the thread you posted them in, but you used the s10forum garage to host them and that doesn't seem to work anymore..thanks I'll post them tomorrow.
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02-09-2006, 01:47 PM	#372
NickZigaitis I Like Fire....HaHaHa Age: 78 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,693 Location: God Damn Garage, STL User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) By popular demand Update: I'm going to explain two methods here. One being the tried and true spandex strech fabric method and the other being the "Sagging" method with relief cutting. At the end, I'll have a contest as to who can tell me which is which. One speaker pod is the strech fabric, the other is the Sagging. Whoever guess correctly gets a pat on the back for paying attention and having a good eye. I'll warn you. You better have a damn good eye. First I'll explain the Strech fabric way of life. 1st off, you'll never ever be able to do this with fleece. Long story short, the fleece is too thick to wrap the edges and still make the pod fit into the original factory hole in the dash. Hell, the spandex made it a snugger-than-stock fit, so good luck with those hardheaded folks and their fleece. 1st, you need to construct a cardboard model to develope the appropriate angle of the speakers for your soundstage (PunkORama, lol, jk). I have mine angled 7* up-plane and 15* toward centerline. Now, this will only work if your speaker selected is small enough to fit in this area and still have enough room to create a smooth transition from speaker edge to grill edge. In my case, I chose Audiobahn speakers with detachable tweets. I likes the bullet shaped cone in the middle of the speaker so I mounted the tweet seperate from the speaker to highlight this bullet shapped cone. 2nd, you need to lay a single layer of glass over the plastic grill. This is to create a flat surface to work with, aside from those pesky tiny holes for the sound. 3rd, Cut a hole in the oem grill large enough to get your speaker through since the speakers will be mounted underneath to studs (much like in the TV dash install first posted in this thread). Construct the platform out of this 1/8" thick plywood and 1/4" x 1x4" square plywood stick. You can use hotglue here to make your platform but I chose to use epoxy for strength sake. Cut the hole in the platform and place the speaker in the hole so you can do your final sizing of that hole and also mark the location for the mounting studs. After you have marked the stud locations, drill a small hole and screw in a 1" metric thread screw from the top. Screw it in only a 1/4" so that there are threads exposed on both sides. On the threads of the top side, apply epoxy to the threads and then screw it in another 1/4" so that roughly a 1/2" of thread is exposed from underneath. After the epoxy has cured, use a dremel and cut the screw head and remaining threads flush with the topside of the plywood platform. (Sorry, No Pics of that, this was done last summer) 4th, Suspend your new pod off the work bench by placing it on top of a small box. Apply your resin and strech the hell out of the fabric over the pod and tack the extra cloth to the bench as seen numerous times before in this thread. Then apply resin to the topside of the stretched fabric. 5th, trim the access off and lay 4 layers of 1/2oz glass. Thats all you need. Then do your bondo and surface prep work for paint. Now for sagging and relief cutting glass (The substitute for strech fabric) Sagging is a method of streching fiberglass between two points of interest without the use of strech fabric. It is a way of sagging the glass between these two points to create a valey between them. Sometimes, the valley between these two points will be eliminated after pulling on the strech fabric, which is why this method comes in handy sometimes. Couple things to note here: 1) You MUST USE WEAVE CLOTHE FIBERGLASS, no matte shit here. 2) You Must have your head out of your butt and watch the glass as it is curing. Meaning, you must watch it from wet to dry and constantly adjust it. I'll explain....... With strech fabric, it is taught and not going anywhere. This sagging, the fabric can't be secured so it constantly moving until that sudden, "pop, its holding to the surface". Again, I'll explain........... Polyester resin is a chemical reaction like epoxy. However, polyester resin also produce something more so than that of epoxy,........Heat. Because the resin is heating up as it cures, its also shrinking. Here is why we use Weave Clothe over Matte. Because weave is threaded strands of fiberglass, these threads and the spacing between them, expand and contract. The expansion and contraction of the weave glass is why is conformes much better to tighter curves than matte. Matte glass is like spagetti mashed together. because of this, the matte glass can't expand or contract which is why its crap for conforming to curves. This shrinking is also why Spandex is preferred over that of T-Shirt. T-shirt is made primarily of cottom. We all know that cotton is suseptible to shrinking from heat and why your small Chow dog can wear your shirt after you was on hot and dry on hot, lol. When the T-shirt, saturated with resin is used, you are more likely to see warping after it is cured. Correcting the warp is a whole other conversation. Because the glass is unsecured and basically floating, as the resin shrinks, its pulling on the glass and drawing the threads of the weave, closer together which is why its moving. This movement is also why you need to constantly watch it and adjust it as it cures to maintain the desired spade of the valley and save yourself bondo time. Relief Cutting Sometimes, even the toughest curves get the better of Weave Glass. So reliefe cuting it and overlapping the cut pie sections will help you conquer a curve. Here is how you do it. lay the glass over the item. Identify the apex of the curve and draw lines on the fiberglass in even segments from the curve. Using sharp sheers only (no shitty scissors here, you'll sprawl the glass). Basically, the area of glass hanging past the curved apex will get pie cut. As you apply the resin, start at one side of these pie cuts and lay each one down individually. They should overlay slightly in shallower curves and more so in tighter curves. Lay down your 1st layer of glass an constantly monitor it and adjust it as it cures to maintain the desired curve. Once this first layer of glass is cured, in essence, its like your strech fabric and can now be used as a more solid basis for additional layers. Again, you'll have to relief cut each additional layer. The next series of pictures shows the sagging (no strech fabric) and if you look closely, you'll see the reliefe cuts and where they overlap. Then do your Bondo work, glazing of pin holes, prime and paint. And the final product. Try and tell me which is which. Which one was Sagged, and which one of Strech Fabric laid? Driver Side? or Passenger side? Sagging is more involved and intensive but a good solution where strech fabric isn't. And, Thats how its done.
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02-09-2006, 02:07 PM	#373
Chappy316 SOLD! Age: 23 Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 3,892 Location: Cedar Point Ohio User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Quote: Originally Posted by NickZigaitis based on this picture i would say the drivers side was stretch fabric because it looks dark blue in there... once they are bondo'd and painted you cant tell i dont think... and i like how you mounted them from below and how they came out flush on top, very pimp!
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02-09-2006, 02:27 PM	#374
NickZigaitis I Like Fire....HaHaHa Age: 78 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,693 Location: God Damn Garage, STL User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) And the Winner is ..... Not Chappy316. The driver side was the pod made using the Sagging technique. Thanks for playing the "Pic the Pod Contest" lol!!! I love fooling you guys.
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02-09-2006, 02:29 PM	#375
NickZigaitis I Like Fire....HaHaHa Age: 78 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,693 Location: God Damn Garage, STL User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Remember. Pay attention to the pics, everything about them. Notice the placement of the tweeter. That should have given it away.
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02-09-2006, 03:00 PM	#376
BIGGERISBETTER flat blue and layin frame Age: 24 Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 5,885 Location: Bolivar, Ohio User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two) Lol
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02-09-2006, 03:06 PM	#377
NickZigaitis I Like Fire....HaHaHa Age: 78 Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 4,693 Location: God Damn Garage, STL User is: OffLine	Re: Teaching Fiberglass (part one and two)