Sas Info

[96superflow]

Alright guys, i know you are probably getting tired of hearing from me, but i keep pondering these questions with the swap. Im still considering either building a front spring hanger or buying the one from sky manufacturing or even the 3leaf fab one. its just that i wanted the 3leaf fab, but my blazer is a 96. So im not Positive that that kit will work. More information would be awesome on it. As far as the axles go, i have access to a gm 10 bolt front, but of course its passenger side differential. so then i would have to change transfer cases. what in the world would bolt up?!?!? for the rear to match i can get a ford 9". thats what im pondering. i could get the 10 bolt for little or nothing, thats why im considering it. But i could also run the hp d30 out of a cherokee with 4.10's and then an 8.8 lsd w/4.10s. Could someone sway my options, and help me make a decision so that i can get this project started by the begining of summer? as far as tires, i will only be running 33's and as far as the amount of lift, will be like 3-5 inches depending on which tuff country ez ride leaf springs i decide on. Thanks guys.

[bodydroppeds10]

If you are only goin to run 33's and no bigger than use the cherokee axles. If you wanna run bigger than 33's then find a set of ford axles.

[Donahue]

good luck getting only 3" of lift from a SAS, especially with a kit like ours. you will likely run into frame clearance issues with anything less than about 6". as for the crossmembers, sorry mine will probably not be available. we will have to put the sas kit on hold because of the poor economy, besides it would not be in the same price range as the sky kit because its vastly different.

anyways, as for the axles. if you wanted to run a pass drop front axle, you can swap out for a pass drop t-case from a full size if you have an auto. if you have a manual, things are more challenging. but assuming auto, you need the adapter from a full size that will give you the 6 round pattern for the t-case. then you can use several gm full size cases, but i would suggest a 241 as the best bet for bolt on and go. you will also need to do some driveshaft work to accommodate a new case. the gm 10b is 6 lug, the ford 9 is 5 so you will have an issue there to resolve. with the HP30/8.8 you would have matching bolt patterns and plently of beef for 33's.

[wrekd]

x3 on the hp30 and 8.8

[96superflow]

Thanks guys, you def helped sway my decision. I already had a Lp30 and a gm10 bolt out of another s10 sitting at my house, but they were 3.73 and i would want something a lil bit taller than that. When i mentioned the lift part, i was just mentioning the spring lift. I think i might go with the tuff country 3'' ez ride for the fullsize blazer, that was excluding the SOA, which should give me anywhere from 2.5 to 3'' more. Another couple of questions i have deal with, if i do use the sky kit (1) How to set the shakle angle for the front end, (2) What would be the best way to get this thing to steer, and Lastly (3) what do i do about my sway bar. I really appreciate all the help for this project.

[Donahue]

well, with a 3" lift spring in the front, you will probably end up about where i am with SOA, about 12". my springs are stock ford f150 rear spring which would normally net about 4" of lift in the front of a full size chevy.

(1) the general setting that i tell people for the front shackles is about 30* from vertical with the top pointing forward. this can be a hard thing to estimate without weight on it, so i would suggest putting some heavy tacks on it and letting the weight down on the springs to see how much they will squat.

(2) crossover is certainly the way to go, and if yo go with a d30, i would suggest the high steer arm that baggey used. but either way, you will want a solid tie rod. at the steering box, you can use the stock one or one from an astro van if you move the axle forward more than about 2-3". the astro box is the same other than the orientation of the pitman arm. for the pitman arm you can use a jeep or ford drop pitman arm (or a stock one to). depending on the TRE's used (most people like GM full size ones) you will need to get the pitman arm to match. the ford pitman arms will fit the taper of the GM TRE's but the jeep arms will need to be re-tapered. if you use jeep TRE's then use the jeep arm. do not use heims if you can avoid it, steering is not the proper use of heims due to the single shear applications.

as for the sway bar, ditch it.

[Baggey22]

http://www.jb4x4.com/products.htm

That's the steering arm Donahue was talking about. If you use 1-ton TREs the steering bracket can also be ordered reamed out for that size.

[96superflow]

Wow, i wasn't expecting to get that much lift out of it. Im only looking to get about 6'' added to my body lift, what would you all recommend to get about that? i like the cross over idea, and that did answer my question about the steering. As for the shakle angle its pretty much guess and check im guessing? thanks for being so helpful with this process.

[Donahue]

to get 6" of lift, you will want a spring that sits flat, or almost negative when the weight of the truck is on it, with SOA. if you went with SUA you could use a higher arched spring. you would probably also want to make the crossmembers as close to the frame as you can.

[96superflow]

Thanks Donahue. I really appreciate all the help. Wish there was some way to support 3 leaf Fab. If you have anything you wanna send out to the east coast to get your name out there, let me know, ill be more than glad to support you. When i finally get the cash to start buying the suspension compoents, ill let you know and hopefully, i can get your crossmembers instead. You have really been one with infinite knowledge, i know when i get started on it, ill be hitting you up for some help.

Im considering the SUA now, and probably the wagoneer 3'' lift springs from rancho. Hopefully i can get this figured out, but i also thought about using rear springs from another blazer, what do you think?

[BillaksBlazer]

if your looking for about 6" of lift deffinatly go sua. im running rancho 44044's spring under with the hpd30 and have about 6" lift. check out my build project 2000 sfa blazer. I have a 2" body lift on mine also. Best advise is to find a truck you like and plan off that. That way you have a general idea how it will turn out. it will never be exact but it will close.

[96superflow]

Well its going to get underway, hopefully within the next month, if the funds support it. Im basing my build off of BillaksBlazer, being that his was setup just as mine was before hand and that i want mine to be like his afterwards. After i get it underway, ill keep everyone posted with pics and everything. Thanks everyone for all the help, and if anyone come up with something that can help out, let me know. Im open to new ideas too.

[BillaksBlazer]

good luck man. remember if you have any questions let me know.

[96superflow]

Alright Guys, i have been searching every where for the RANCHO 44044 lift spring with the ubolts and everything included, and can't find it anywhere. I did find a rough country lift kit complete with ubolts, shocks, and rear block( which i wont use) all for 335 buck directly from rough country; the cheapest i could find JUST the RANCHO leaf springs was around 200 a piece. Shouldn't these have the same specs as the RANCHO springs as far as dimensions? Im not real worried about spring rates, but it would be nicer to have it a lil bit softer to keep the ride on the road better than a leaf sprung heep, as well as the articulation aspect.

[wrekd]

I got mine from Summit Racing. I think they were around $350 shipped.

[96superflow]

ah ok, thank wrekd! but those are just the springs correct? guess we cant get um with the ubolts and plates included?

[wrekd]

yep, that was just the springs.

[BillaksBlazer]

like i said in the pm the racho kit for the grand wogoneer no longer has the u bolts. They wouldnt work anyway because they are for a dana 44 and not the 30. go to autozone or whatever they have u bolts.

[96superflow]

you think with that much lift, i can get by with running 35's? I found a pretty good deal on some, and i may go for it. i have already done some fender trimming, but im guessing i would have to do more.

[Donahue]

just to let you know, with a conversion like this, spring rate has a lot to do with the overall effectiveness.

[wrekd]

Quote: Originally Posted by BillaksBlazer

like i said in the pm the racho kit for the grand wogoneer no longer has the u bolts. They wouldnt work anyway because they are for a dana 44 and not the 30. go to autozone or whatever they have u bolts.

Dont get those autozone u-bolts. I was blowing the threads right off those pieces of shit. Go to your local spring shop and get some good ones.

[Donahue]

we get ours locally, they are not that bad as far as price.

[96superflow]

So the spring rates that would come on any wagoneer lift kit would be alright? or i guess a better question would be what the optimal spring rate should be around? I want to keep it as much of a daily driver as possible, but also be able to throw it in a local mud bog, muddy trail, hunting trail, or maybe even some rocks.

[wrekd]

Its $10 per u-bolt at my local spring shop and they're strong as hell.

[Donahue]

the better question is how much lift do you want?

[96superflow]

cool cool thats good to know. they come with all the hardware and plates too?

[96superflow]

Right now im looking at 6-8 inchs. Ive been pming with billaksblazer, and want to run a similar set up, involving the SUA, making it easier to deal with the steering as of now, with running the dana 30, i know that if decide i want more lift later, i will go with SOA and a dana 44. So having a set of springs that would work well with being able to change it later would be great.

[wrekd]

Quote: Originally Posted by 96superflow

cool cool thats good to know. they come with all the hardware and plates too?

They should come with the nuts and washers (mine do), but spring plates will be seperate. The place I get mine from doesn't even sell the plates so I just ordered mine online.

[sewerrat]

I'm not sure if your 96 has a xmember under the engine but I had to notch mine on my 85 to clear the front driveshaft on my SUA, hp30. Very easy to do though. Goodluck

[wrekd]

Quote: Originally Posted by sewerrat

I'm not sure if your 96 has a xmember under the engine but I had to notch mine on my 85 to clear the front driveshaft on my SUA, hp30. Very easy to do though. Goodluck

Mine had one. I just cut it off.

[96superflow]

that means mine has one too more than likely. I dont know about cutting it off, dont wanna loose any structural frame strength.

[Tim99Zr2]

i cut it off, you gain strength back when you weld up your new cross member up front

[Donahue]

just make sure you cut the stock one off last.

this is the one i made.

[96superflow]

Thats awesome, i will definitely do that. If you don't mind me asking, Donahue, What did you make yours from, and how did you make your flat spots? i was thinking of doing something similar, but putting it in-between the frame-rails.

And would you all recommend going ahead and doing the astro steering box swap?

[Donahue]

mine is just .120 wall HREW tube, 1.5" diameter. i made the flat spots with a BFH and a brick

i like mine because i can pull my oil pan without touching the motor mounts and it clears my steering and everything else.

i would recommend installing a crossmember under the engine in addition to the sas crossmember.

only do the astro box if you move the axle foward. you can always try it with the stock box and get the astro later.

i have the astro box in the picture, but with the arm flipped 180*. i am also using the ford pitman arm i mentioned earlier.

[Tim99Zr2]

Quote: Originally Posted by Donahue

i have the astro box in the picture, but with the arm flipped 180*. i am also using the ford pitman arm i mentioned earlier.

wouldnt that make your steering back wards?

[Donahue]

Quote: Originally Posted by Tim99Zr2

wouldnt that make your steering back wards?

yes

[96superflow]

He ran his steering behind his axle, which, if im not mistaken, would allow it to be correct again?

[Tim99Zr2]

Quote: Originally Posted by 96superflow

He ran his steering behind his axle, which, if im not mistaken, would allow it to be correct again?

hmm. i see. that correct donahue?

[Donahue]

yeah, my drag link comes in behind the axle, not in front. its like i have a double negative.

[96superflow]

Well guys, id figure i will give you an update on where i stand. I was searching the other night for some stronger axles, and couldn't really find what i wanted, so then i was down to my last search for a wagoneer, and whal-la one popped up right near my home town for $350 bucks. I went nuts. I called the guy right then, only to remember it was a sunday, so i left a message and called back to day. Its a 1987 that was being restored, up until 4 years ago when the owner suffer a serious car accident. So now, the guy is holding it for me and im hopefully getting it. The only bad thing is, the way it was described, it is almost completely finished and i haven't seen it to make the choice in pullin the d44s out and using them in my swap or building the old waggy. Its got a 360 in it and looks damn good. guess im gonna have to make that choice later...........what do yall think?

[sewerrat]

pics of the waggy?

[96superflow]

[Donahue]

its likely got an AMC 20 rear, but one of the good ones.

[jwglover]

should be d44 front and rear, spring unders in the front, not sure in the back ( cant remember ) good start to a project

[Donahue]

i wonder what trucks got the 20's and what trucks got the 44's. i believe all the quadratrac trucks for the offset 44, but will assume there is also a centered 44? i wonder what makes a truck get either, could it be the wide verse narrow track?

[DieselS10]

The`axle in the front of Gump's truck is from a Widetrack Wagoneer and it was VERY difficult to find P-side axle shafts for it until we figured out late 70's Ford D44s are within an 1/8" of the Jeep shaft.

[96superflow]

this one is a narrow track. I have decided that im going to build it if it is in good enough shape. I always have the other axles for my sas into my blazer which i may attempt as well this summer. depending if all the funds are there.

[96superflow]

Figured i would give ya'll an update. Well so much for the wagoneer. I rode up to check it out today to see what my plan would be, the asshole sold it out from underneath me. So no chance in d44's right now. Back to the original plan of using the d30 and my 10-bolt rear, unless i can get an 8.8 for cheap. We shall see, i get my nice paycheck this week, and im gonna start ordering parts for the lift. Gonna use the sky's hangar kit, and rancho 44044 springs. I will keep everyone updated. Wish me luck.

[96superflow]

Alright. Another question has come to mind from pondering this swap. I am doing it, just a matter of getting all the parts and hopefully starting on it next weekend. When i get all my brackets cut off of the dana 30, what pinion angle should i set when i put the perches on the bottom and mount it to the spring? my brother is saying about 5*. I have no clue. Let me know what ya'll think.