Had U joints and Hanger bearing relpaced, now vibrates worse.

[beatcars]

Ok my 97 Sonoma extended cab has 3 U joints, I knew 2 were going. After the shop replaced all 3 and the hanger bearing (which they diagnosed as going), the truck vibrates pretty bad above 30mph. Any ideas what they did wrong or didn't do right? My wheels are all balanced perfect and the tires are new.

[Hoss]

First thing I'd do is take it back. If you wanted to you could try to isolate where the vibration is coming from. Is it something you feel in the steering or does it feel like it's coming from the back? If it feels like it's coming from the back of the truck try swapping the rear tires to the front, then see if it changes. If it's something with the wheels/tires you should really then feel it in the steering, could possibly be something like a bent rim, or bad or improperly balanced tire. You didn't mention if they replaced the tires at the same time as doing this work, if those tires have been on there prior to the driveshaft repair and it didn't vibrate before that would rule the wheels/tires out as a possibility.

It could even be possible that they could've improperly installed the ujoint, I've seen where if they are not seated perfectly they won't swivel as freely as they are supposed to, which will result in a vibration. Could be a dented or inbalanced driveshaft. It could be a lot of things, it's just ends up being process of elimination.

But if you paid a reputable shop to fix it I would definitely take it back. Especially if it didn't do all of that before they worked on it.

[mesterz2889]

it could be a number of things such as a bent rim or driveshaft but depending on how long you endured the initial vibrations before you took it to get fixed than its probably the constant velocity joint thats bad, which is a 4 dollar part. that would be my guess its just a little piece of stamped sheet metal that makes sure your cardan joint(the double u joint spot)stays lined up which sucks cause you have to let them do it and make sure they balance it too. kinda sounds like they dont know what they are doing if they replaced your support bearing too. it could also be your wheel bearings but id check into the constant velocity joint first.

[beatcars]

Ok we've been to heck and back, and found one rear tire with shifted belts (it was a tire with only 4k on it!) Tire replaced and new one checked out on the "road force conditions" machine. The shake is still there. Now the tech says he ran it on the lift with no rims/tires on and hears a noise in the rear end each revolution. Says could be a case,axle, or pinion bearing. Could that shake the truck?

[mesterz2889]

if your truck is an extended cab its probably the constant velocity if its either the pinion or wheel bearing they are both easy enough to change on your own. when your driving put your hand on the floor board in the back if it feel strong there its the cvj. in mine i replaced all 4 wheel bearings the support bearing and a few u joints and it ended up being the cvj. good luck

[beatcars]

What is the constant velocity joint? And where?

[beatcars]

What is the constant velocity joint? And where? Yes it is an extended cab, 3 U joints and a hanger.

[mesterz2889]

google that shit its hard to explain

[mesterz2889]

its in there thats called a double cardan joint the constant velocity joint is inside where you cant see like a ball and a cup theres a ball on the driveshaft side and a cup on the flange side (or the other way around) the ball rides in the cup and keeps the two u joints running straight if your is damaged than the u joints will just flop around

[mesterz2889]

its a bad design very bulky thats why aftermarket companies have made these http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/_Car-...3756.m20.l1116 i dont know if thats the exact one for your truck

[penning4544]

I thought that I heard that these driveshafts are balanced and then have to be put together the same way so that the weights on the driveshafts line up like they did from the factory. Also the center support bearing has to be shimmed just right also if I remember correctly. When I worked at the Audi dealership, that was a problem we would sometimes have. Just my 2 cents.

[mesterz2889]

well theres only two ways it can be put back together and that shim crap is nonsence the geometry of the bearing is changed if you lower your truck and it still works fine but an audi may be a different story

[TOMMYGUNZZSS]

I'm having this same issue right now. Mine does it from 15 mph to about 21 mph on acceleration and braking. Brand new tires with only about 100 miles on them. Would I hear any specific noises that would clue me in?

[beatcars]

THanks, ya that shaft is for 98 and up, mines a 97. heres some info:

Was told at another auto "help" site these things just today:

did they remove the serpentine belt with the engine running ?
did they place the transmission in nuetral at hiway speeds and turn the engine off ?
Has anyone performed a stall test ?
Those are some simple tests to better diagnose the problem - engine or driveline related ?
----Find out what speed(s) the vibration occurs while coasting.
Find a hill that the vehicle will coast down at that speed.
Drive to the top of the hill.
On a level portion of the top of the hill, apply the parking brake and chock the wheels.
Remove drive shaft.
Remove the chocks.
Sit in the drivers seat.
Unapply the parking brake.
Be aware that the power part of the power brakes and the power part of the power steering are not gonna work with the engine off.
Only turn the engine on if the transmission output is of a sealed flange type. Do not turn on the engine if the output is a slip yoke type sealed by the slip yoke that you removed (see "Be aware" above).
Have a friend give you a little push (forward preferably) off of the flat spot until you start rolling down the hill.
Note vibration at indicated speed...

gone = most likely drive shaft vibration (possible gear, but not likely as gear is still turning, but does not have any forward load so maybe possible... anything is possible I suppose...)(That was my "disclaimer" for the pessimists in the group.)

not gone = most likely not drive shaft vibration...


My reply = I don't think any of those were done.

I can do this one "place the transmission in neutral at hiway speeds and turn the engine off"
I know it vibrates at the same speeds in the same way if in neutral or not but haven't checked with engine off only idling.
Vibration starts around 25 mph and is worst around 33, then gets better only because the vibration is faster after that (pretty much).

TIMELINE WHAT WAS DONE: the first time I brought it in just the 3 new U joints and new hanger brng were done, the vibration got a little worse. Then took the truck to get tires "roadforce" tested, (these were newer tires with under 6k on them, and stock rims)right rear failed test and was replaced, slightly better feel to vibration, not much. Then tech discovered rear brakes shot due to ebrake stuck, figures the drums were teh vibration, new brake drums/shoes/springs. Still shakin.
Took off rear diff cover and inspected, did axle seals and outer axle brngs while in there for brakes/inspect.
Then redid the 3 joints and hnger brng with new ones again just to be sure, returned other joints back to NAPA, all were TIMKEN brand, now saying "the shaft has to be bad somehow, maybe inside".

Can the back half of the shaft "go bad" with no outer signs of dents or weight probs?
He also says they'd have to ship it to the Twin cities to balance the shaft, as no one has a machine to do that, not even dealers.

[mesterz2889]

if you call that company i gave you a link for they can probably make one for your truck itll be cheaper than when it completely fails from running around like it is

[Steve44]

Quote: Originally Posted by beatcars

THanks, ya that shaft is for 98 and up, mines a 97. heres some info:

Was told at another auto "help" site these things just today:

did they remove the serpentine belt with the engine running ?
did they place the transmission in nuetral at hiway speeds and turn the engine off ?
Has anyone performed a stall test ?
Those are some simple tests to better diagnose the problem - engine or driveline related ?
----Find out what speed(s) the vibration occurs while coasting.
Find a hill that the vehicle will coast down at that speed.
Drive to the top of the hill.
On a level portion of the top of the hill, apply the parking brake and chock the wheels.
Remove drive shaft.
Remove the chocks.
Sit in the drivers seat.
Unapply the parking brake.
Be aware that the power part of the power brakes and the power part of the power steering are not gonna work with the engine off.
Only turn the engine on if the transmission output is of a sealed flange type. Do not turn on the engine if the output is a slip yoke type sealed by the slip yoke that you removed (see "Be aware" above).
Have a friend give you a little push (forward preferably) off of the flat spot until you start rolling down the hill.
Note vibration at indicated speed...

gone = most likely drive shaft vibration (possible gear, but not likely as gear is still turning, but does not have any forward load so maybe possible... anything is possible I suppose...)(That was my "disclaimer" for the pessimists in the group.)

not gone = most likely not drive shaft vibration...


My reply = I don't think any of those were done.

I can do this one "place the transmission in neutral at hiway speeds and turn the engine off"
I know it vibrates at the same speeds in the same way if in neutral or not but haven't checked with engine off only idling.
Vibration starts around 25 mph and is worst around 33, then gets better only because the vibration is faster after that (pretty much).

TIMELINE WHAT WAS DONE: the first time I brought it in just the 3 new U joints and new hanger brng were done, the vibration got a little worse. Then took the truck to get tires "roadforce" tested, (these were newer tires with under 6k on them, and stock rims)right rear failed test and was replaced, slightly better feel to vibration, not much. Then tech discovered rear brakes shot due to ebrake stuck, figures the drums were teh vibration, new brake drums/shoes/springs. Still shakin.
Took off rear diff cover and inspected, did axle seals and outer axle brngs while in there for brakes/inspect.
Then redid the 3 joints and hnger brng with new ones again just to be sure, returned other joints back to NAPA, all were TIMKEN brand, now saying "the shaft has to be bad somehow, maybe inside".

Can the back half of the shaft "go bad" with no outer signs of dents or weight probs?
He also says they'd have to ship it to the Twin cities to balance the shaft, as no one has a machine to do that, not even dealers.

I'm a Licenced Mechanic, and although I've been off the floor for 15 years, I've never heard such nonsense. "Park on a hill and take out your driveshaft????" I have the same problem only at lower speeds. Mine starts at 22MPH and ends at 26 MPH. I changed the U-joints, and it got better, but never did go away. Mine's a 96. The shaft that was in it still had the stickers on it! It ain't the rear end, it ain't the engine. Vibration exists whether trans is in N or D or OD. I think that it is adesign flaw and they corrected it with the CV or double U-joint shaft. This was found on older luxury cars. I don't have a cheap solution, and I'm not about to throw any more dough at the problem. Do they make an updated aftermarket shaft for the 94-97 S-10/Sonoma that addresses these problems?

[beatcars]

Thats where we are at now, putting a different shaft in from another truck. That has GOT to be it.

[dillon_b12]

Quote: Originally Posted by beatcars

Thats where we are at now, putting a different shaft in from another truck. That has GOT to be it.

When I was chasing a vibration in my truck it ended up being a combination of a worn out motor mount as well as a worn out tranny mount and worn out carrier bearing.

I also had alot of driveline alignment issues due to lowering that I corrected.

[02dime]

check your motor mounts also, i had a vib in certain speeds that were low and high,had my tires balanced the steady was replaced and it was still there,than when i pulled my motor for the 5.3 swap there it was BAM broken mount

[terryl]

Here's something to confuse you a little more. You said they replaced the outer axle bearings. There is a chance, if one was bad, that the axle is bad also where the bearing wore a grove in it. If so, putting a new bearing in without a new axle, will not fix the problem, the vibration will continue and the bearing will go bad again. It's possible they put a "bearing saver" on the axle instead of replacing the axle, which would be ok. The bearing saver makes the bearing ride offset on the axle on a different surface than before.

[SlammedSonoma96]

I just found this thread and the funny thing is, I just was talking to a driveline repair shop about a friend of mine's S10. He has the same problem in his truck. The driveline shop's first question to me was "Does it have the 4.3"? If so, the driveline joints are junk for the 94-97 S10's with the 4.3. He has replaced at least 20 of them within the last 5 years.

My suggestion is to get a new driveline.

[beatcars]

So its at a different shop now...

Is it near impossible to find used driveshafts for these extended cab Sonomas? They found a back half of the shaft used... $170 for the part and it took a few trys to get the right one. they say its not worth trying to find a front half, I should try and get this one balanced.
It seems they blame someone putting the shafts in a vice and thus bending them while getting the u joints out. (That would be the first mechanic)

[beatcars]

Fixed. Both halves of the shaft had to be replaced. This shop said it appears someone put them in a vice and either "squished" or bent them while removing the stock U joints. This bill from this shop came to $393.

Do any of you have any suggestions as to recourse? Is it possible the smaller shop would reimburse me some of that $393, because they damaged my driveshafts? The guy who runs it is the main mechanic but had two younger fellas working there off and on and its entirely possible one of them was put on U joint removal duty. The owner/mechanic also at one point said he was swamped with work and can't find any good reliable knowledgable help. Wish I had that on tape.

[Yogi]

I would take the bill to the first shop and tell them that you want to be repaid. If he won't pay, take him to small claims court and sue his ass!

[ph33rzie]

Quote: Originally Posted by Yogi

I would take the bill to the first shop and tell them that you want to be repaid. If he won't pay, take him to small claims court and sue his ass!

X2, on your bill from shop #2 make sure they have stated what appeared to be the problem they are correcting, little details like that will definitely help your case if you have to go that road.