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Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

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Old 01-13-2006, 08:12 PM   #1
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Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Well I got my blazer ('02, 4.3 v6) dyno'ed today and like the title says I'm a little disappointed. Made three pulls on a Mustang dyno....peak rwp was only 175.5 and peak rwt was 243.3 lb ft. A/F was 11.7. Not bad I guess but I was hoping for more.
I've got the wynjammer kit installed running at 6psi, ls1 edit ecu, cold air intake, flowmaster 40 exhaust w/ 2" piping, and a flex 60 efan.
I know for a fact that my whole exhaust system is restrictive and is hurting my performance. The flow 40 sounds good but those baffles have gotta be robbing me of some precious ponies. I'm gonna look into getting some jba headers and a straight through muffler, probably upgrade to 2.5" piping w/ a custom Y-Pipe too.
I have an automatic so the torque converter's suckin' up hp too. Actually quite a bit, the tech at the shop told me that's costing me at least 40 hp. Bummer.
Any other suggestions as to what I could do to get some more power???

Old 01-13-2006, 08:35 PM   #2
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

That is way off what it should be. You should be getting atleast 200+ whp and 250+ rwt. I mean that is almost stock, stock 4.3 dyno is 150ish and 210ish. Also the converter costing 40hp is bull.
Old 01-13-2006, 09:11 PM   #3
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Its cause its on a mustang dyno. Those rate really low, but closer to the actual reading. Don't feel too bad, my friends 95 Camaro Z28 that ran a 13.4 in the 1/4 only dynoed at 243 hp on a stang dyno.
Old 01-13-2006, 09:34 PM   #4
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Hey do you have a boost gauge on it to know if your actually getting all the boost you should ? I know thats kinda a dumb question etc but that was the biggest pain with mine on the TBI freaking air leaks, first night it was kinda weak, after a couple hours of messing around with fittings and angles i got it to seal pretty good. I only have a 4lbs kit and my truck was only 120's rwhp on a gtech before i started. With a air pretty good air leak i pulled high 140's. Once i fixed the air leak i was getting steady 170-175rwhp ON A GTech though keep in mind... granted there supposed to be pretty accurate but who knows, I did run two different gtechs and a bunch of times to kinda get a average.

Also i have talked to a guy with same setup as you for the most part that pulled 238 RWHP on a 6lbs kit (which i think is the best to date a stock new truck has ran.)
Old 01-13-2006, 10:03 PM   #5
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

go with a 3" exhaust.
Old 01-14-2006, 04:49 PM   #6
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote: Originally Posted by brock1949
Hey do you have a boost gauge on it to know if your actually getting all the boost you should ? I know thats kinda a dumb question etc but that was the biggest pain with mine on the TBI freaking air leaks, first night it was kinda weak, after a couple hours of messing around with fittings and angles i got it to seal pretty good. I only have a 4lbs kit and my truck was only 120's rwhp on a gtech before i started. With a air pretty good air leak i pulled high 140's. Once i fixed the air leak i was getting steady 170-175rwhp ON A GTech though keep in mind... granted there supposed to be pretty accurate but who knows, I did run two different gtechs and a bunch of times to kinda get a average.

Also i have talked to a guy with same setup as you for the most part that pulled 238 RWHP on a 6lbs kit (which i think is the best to date a stock new truck has ran.)
Yes I've got a boost gauge but I have yet to install it. Definetely something I'll check when I hook it up. That is interesting though, never really thought about that b/c I figured if it was leaking air it would run like $hit.
I know something's definetely not right, it runs great but like I said my hp rating just seems way too low.
Old 01-14-2006, 04:56 PM   #7
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Not bad for a Mustang dyno. My 3.4L grand am dynoed 143.2HP with 176Tq on a mustang dyno, my only mod was a borla catback.
Old 01-14-2006, 05:00 PM   #8
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

i second hellbents... go with 3 inch... your blown... so you should go big... 2 inch piping on that motor being blown is joke...
Old 01-14-2006, 05:44 PM   #9
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Yeah the exhaust is the first thing I'm changing...I'll most definetely go w/ the 3" tubing plus the custom y-pipe. Another quick question, can the 'cat be removed on a 2002? Casper electronics makes an O2 Sim specifically for our trucks but it says it only goes up the the '01 Model year.
Also I'll be gettin' this thing dynoed again in the future once I'm done w/ the exhaust and what not. I see you guys aren't fans of the mustang dyno, personally I don't know much about them...which brand dyno should I get it tested on?
Old 01-14-2006, 05:48 PM   #10
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Dynojet if possible. Get that exhaust fixed soon though, 2 inch on a blown 4.3 is insane.
Old 01-14-2006, 06:05 PM   #11
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote: Originally Posted by blu_sleeper02
Another quick question, can the 'cat be removed on a 2002? Casper electronics makes an O2 Sim specifically for our trucks but it says it only goes up the the '01 Model year.
i dont have a 96 or newer truck so i'm not sure, but cant you take care of any problems associated with removing your cat with your LS1-edit?
Old 01-14-2006, 08:53 PM   #12
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Going to a dynojet from a mustang dyno will only satisfy your eyes.. Stick with the dyno that you started on the way you know what the differences are when you start to upgrade.. Also a dynojet doesn't add resistance to the rear tires like a mustang dyno does.. There for a mustang dyno will give you more accurate results of what kind of power your truck is making to the road. Definitly go with the 3" with a straight through muffler design.. I perfer Borla, but any straight through design will work. Truckin dynoed a vortech kit on a 98 SS a few years ago and got 204hp and I think 253ftlbs @8psi. That was a bone stock truck all the way to the exhaust.. I don't know if it was a dynojet or mustang, but your numbers aren't to far off considering you are only running 6psi. With a catback exhaust system only on a dynojet I layed down 159hp and 211ftlbs. If that where a mustang dyno the numbers would have been around 7to9 percent less. Hope this helps. Don't feel to down,, track times are what matter.. Look at mustangs and supras, most of them are just dyno queens. They can lay down big numbers but they can't lay down good track times..

Jay
Old 01-14-2006, 09:31 PM   #13
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Well said Jay!

If you run at the track, judge your ETs rather than your HP. If you can throw down mid to low 15s on that setup, you're golden.
Old 01-14-2006, 10:42 PM   #14
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

I just ran stock on a mustang dyno tonight, ran 155HP/205ft-lbs torque...
Old 01-14-2006, 10:53 PM   #15
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Hey, glad to see you got that supercharger on. Your A/F Ratio look good.. Considering everybody bashed Wynjammer for that. This used to be my kit off my blazer.. Make sure your belts are all tight, and all your air intanke pipes are airtight.. The boost gauge will help out on seeing how much boost you have... That will help you troubleshoot. I hooked a Boost gauge up under my hood just to make sure I had full 6psi..
Old 01-14-2006, 11:31 PM   #16
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Definitely make sure that the belts are tight man! I was running only 6psi on my 12psi pulley when my belt wasnt tight enough. You REALLY gotta beat the crap out of the tensioner pulley and get that belt really tight! I also heard that you can use the traction additive people use for drag strips on the belts, but I cant say for sure.

You could also look into getting an exhaust cutout.
Old 01-15-2006, 12:42 PM   #17
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

by the looks of that graph, someone needs to go back to the tuning software and try again. you can post up all of the and this cost me power and that cost me power, etc,, but at the track the truck that dyno'd that is going to have a hard time breaking into the 14's which is sad for having put a blower on.
Old 01-15-2006, 01:22 PM   #18
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote: Originally Posted by MKR
by the looks of that graph, someone needs to go back to the tuning software and try again. you can post up all of the and this cost me power and that cost me power, etc,, but at the track the truck that dyno'd that is going to have a hard time breaking into the 14's which is sad for having put a blower on.


Old 01-15-2006, 01:41 PM   #19
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Ok, so a mustang dyno shows less HP than a Dynojet... Given the fact that Slacker went on a mustang and dynoed 155rwhp (stock) and you dynoed 175rwhp (blown) That shows that you only gained 20rwhp which to me is not that impressive. Im not trying to put you down but the 2" exhaust needs to go, and check your timing to see if the truck is pulling timing away.... You should dyno 200rwhp on a stang dyno.
Old 01-15-2006, 04:36 PM   #20
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

You can't compare that way accurately.. Two different dynos (although the same kind) and two different trucks.. Plus slacker could've had a factory freak. After I dynoed stock, I added a small crane blower cam, a vortech kit, and edelbrock headers with the 2.5" catback borla and put down 292hp and 298ftlbs on the same dynojet. I also went 13.6 @ 105.9 with that setup. NO TUNE OR FMU. I used the fuel sylinoid from a nitrous kit hooked to a Hobbs switch set to come on at 3 psi of boost.. All motors are different. I could have grabbed low 13's with just a tune.. Now compare that to the second motor that got installed. Heads, bigger cam, more boost, tuned, 3" exhaust, and FMU I layed down 278hp and 310ftlbs I think it was. That was on a mustang dyno. Had that been the same dynojet it would have been over 300 for sure.. But with the further upgrades you would expect more.. But the first motor was different. Hell with the first motor, I ran a 14.0 @100 at 03 nats running like 10.1 A/F ratio, if not fatter.. Different motors = different power..

Jay


Quote: Originally Posted by liftmys10
Ok, so a mustang dyno shows less HP than a Dynojet... Given the fact that Slacker went on a mustang and dynoed 155rwhp (stock) and you dynoed 175rwhp (blown) That shows that you only gained 20rwhp which to me is not that impressive. Im not trying to put you down but the 2" exhaust needs to go, and check your timing to see if the truck is pulling timing away.... You should dyno 200rwhp on a stang dyno.
Old 01-16-2006, 05:34 PM   #21
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote:
By the looks of that graph, someone needs to go back to the tuning software and try again. you can post up all of the and this cost me power and that cost me power, etc,, but at the track the truck that dyno'd that is going to have a hard time breaking into the 14's which is sad for having put a blower on.
I ordered a whole new pcm from pcmforless, it's the LS1 edit programmed specifically for my application. Bad tune? I don't know, that's why I posted this thread. I know for a fact my A/F is good so the tune can't be that bad.


Quote:
Hey, glad to see you got that supercharger on. Your A/F Ratio look good.. Considering everybody bashed Wynjammer for that. This used to be my kit off my blazer.. Make sure your belts are all tight, and all your air intanke pipes are airtight.. The boost gauge will help out on seeing how much boost you have... That will help you troubleshoot. I hooked a Boost gauge up under my hood just to make sure I had full 6psi..
Thanks man, the kit's workin' great so far, but as you see my hp #'s seem a little low. I'm hoping it's just b/c I have an air leak somewhere...we'll see as time goes on and I get more of a chance to mess w/ it.




You guys have all been a big help so far, thanks for all your input. I'll keep everybody posted as my progress goes onward.
Old 01-16-2006, 08:57 PM   #22
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Would changing your rear gear ratio from say a 3.07 to a 3.42 show a difference on the dyno?
Old 01-18-2006, 08:10 PM   #23
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote: Originally Posted by FRC FED
Would changing your rear gear ratio from say a 3.07 to a 3.42 show a difference on the dyno?

yes.
Old 01-18-2006, 08:18 PM   #24
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Yeah man, def. check your lines for air leaks, I had a vacuum line leak and it cost me 7 lbs of boost, I was wondering why my guage only said 4 lbs, that was it, vacuum leak. New line and back to 11 lbs, easy fix, yeah, and make sure that belt is tight. Do you have a less restrictive air filter in there? FPR?
Old 01-19-2006, 01:20 AM   #25
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

sorry to jump in here, but ive got the same blower on my 00' 4.3L. I was just about to get my exhaust done this weekend, What size should i get my y-pipe made, ive grinded it down, from being too low, so im hoping to have a custom one made goin over the crossmember instead of under. then i guess i would go 3" from the cat back ?, i have JBA headers (shorties), if that makes a diff.
Or should i go 3" from my headers back?
I havent had a chance to take mine on the dyno yet but i would like to see what its at
My budddy with an 04' 4x4 dodge Hemi dynoed at 200hp on a mustang dyno he has a intake, throttle body spacer, and a programmer
Old 01-19-2006, 09:57 AM   #26
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

That goes to so you how F'ed up those hemi's are.. They suck.. It's rated at 345 and only buts down 200hp with mods.. If I were him I'd take that thing back to the scrapyard(dodge dealership) and show them the dyno sheet.. By the way, make sure you run a 3 inch exhaust.. 2.5 inch y-pipe.

Jay

Last edited by badaSS98; 01-19-2006 at 09:58 AM. Reason: spelling
Old 01-19-2006, 10:16 AM   #27
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote: Originally Posted by badaSS98
That goes to so you how F'ed up those hemi's are.. They suck.. It's rated at 345 and only buts down 200hp with mods.. If I were him I'd take that thing back to the scrapyard(dodge dealership) and show them the dyno sheet.. By the way, make sure you run a 3 inch exhaust.. 2.5 inch y-pipe.

Jay
Well its not the HEMI its the dyno.... mustang dynos suck
Old 01-19-2006, 03:55 PM   #28
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote: Originally Posted by bagged4life2
Well its not the HEMI its the dyno.... mustang dynos suck
Yeah they sure do suck alright .... You might want to do some research to back that claim up a little more because I will tell you that you are wrong. Mustang dynos will give more consistant results time after time than a Dynojet. Just because they read a lower HP doesn't mean it is any less accurate than a Egojet.

Last edited by Zq-8_dawg; 01-19-2006 at 03:56 PM.
Old 01-20-2006, 11:29 AM   #29
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Well to people that never go to the track, or didn't even know what a dyno was until they read about it here, a mustang dyno sucks..Dynojets arent' as accurate as a mustang dyno that's that.. Besides, if that truck only put down 200 on any dyno I would still be pissed!!!

Jay


Quote: Originally Posted by Zq-8_dawg
Yeah they sure do suck alright .... You might want to do some research to back that claim up a little more because I will tell you that you are wrong. Mustang dynos will give more consistant results time after time than a Dynojet. Just because they read a lower HP doesn't mean it is any less accurate than a Egojet.
Old 01-20-2006, 12:00 PM   #30
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote: Originally Posted by Zq-8_dawg
Yeah they sure do suck alright .... You might want to do some research to back that claim up a little more because I will tell you that you are wrong. Mustang dynos will give more consistant results time after time than a Dynojet. Just because they read a lower HP doesn't mean it is any less accurate than a Egojet.
Sorry i wrote that wrong... they give consistantly wrong numbers
Old 01-20-2006, 07:19 PM   #31
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Hooked up the boost/vacuum gauge today, either something really isn't right or I just hooked it up wrong...I started a new thread here......http://www.s10forum.com/forum/showth...35#post2988335
Old 01-26-2006, 05:20 PM   #32
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Hooked up the boost gauge to my intake, getting a full 6lbs at WOT. I tried tying it into a vacuum line (so I can see if I have any vac leaks) but got no boost reading that way. Now I'm officially stumped. Could it really be my exhaust that's costing me that much hp?
Old 01-26-2006, 05:30 PM   #33
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

You know I just thought of something too, maybe that LS1 Edit from pcmforless just ain't cuttin' it. Like I said I ordered a whole new pcm, could they have possibly put in the wrong parameters or something to that degree.
Anybody know of any dyno shops anywhere in Florida that has the capability to do an LS1 tune/edit??? If this could be my problem I'll gladly pay to have it done right.
Old 01-27-2006, 03:42 AM   #34
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

didnt u get a programmer from AL when u bought ur blower?
i didnt program my truck properly the first time and it ran like crap only made 3psi then i installed it again and it went to 6psi made a hell of a diff.
Old 01-27-2006, 08:52 AM   #35
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

The Mustang dynos are far superior in all respects to a Dynojet unit. People think they are inaccurate because they read 'low', but as Jay said earlier, the Mustang dyno can load the engine, giving you a more realistic HP/TQ reading. Some people load it at 20%, some at 10%. When a friend of minetook his full-size RAM to get it tuned, he put down 247HP/288TQ to the rear wheels on this dyno. This was with a 408 N/A motor, turning 35's, and I watched the dyno guy load the drum to 20%. Not the number he was expecting to see, but a fairly accurate number none the less.

It is important to remember what Jay also said earlier. Use the same dyno all the time. It is a tool. If you start changing dynos every time you go, you will NEVER get accurate results to the modifications you make.
Old 01-27-2006, 09:45 AM   #36
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

A lot of shops will not even give corrected data either. Which I think they should be using the same standars as the OE man. The shop down the road from me actually does this, everybody thinks that their numbers are low, but in reality they are very accurate.
Old 01-27-2006, 10:41 AM   #37
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote:
didnt u get a programmer from AL when u bought ur blower?
Mine came w/ a programmed ECU


Okay, I agree totally w/ what all you guys say; but it just seems like everybody else w/ this kit claims to be getting more power w/ the same or similar setup as mine, and they've got the printouts to prove it. Whether it be the dynojet or mustang dyno's, I've seen #'s on both that are much higher than mine.
The quest goes on..............
Old 01-27-2006, 07:25 PM   #38
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote: Originally Posted by blu_sleeper02
Mine came w/ a programmed ECU


Okay, I agree totally w/ what all you guys say; but it just seems like everybody else w/ this kit claims to be getting more power w/ the same or similar setup as mine, and they've got the printouts to prove it. Whether it be the dynojet or mustang dyno's, I've seen #'s on both that are much higher than mine.
The quest goes on..............

i must have missed it, who made big power with a wynjammer so far?
Old 01-27-2006, 08:07 PM   #39
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

i think his name is lyonsfam or something. hes got his dyno runs on video. he put down 238hp i believe
Old 01-27-2006, 08:08 PM   #40
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote: Originally Posted by blu_sleeper02
Hooked up the boost gauge to my intake, getting a full 6lbs at WOT. I tried tying it into a vacuum line (so I can see if I have any vac leaks) but got no boost reading that way. Now I'm officially stumped. Could it really be my exhaust that's costing me that much hp?
perhaps. only one way to be sure. just like hooking up a pressure gauge to the intake, hook up a pressure gauge to your exhaust system to measure your backpressure.

if you have air injection system, you can use one of the tubes to the exh. manifolds as a test port. you can fabricate several different ways to hook up a test connection, but what i did was obtain a used air tube to the manifold, cut off the end, and fabricate an adaptor to connect a vac. line to it, and route a long vac. hose into the cab, with a pressure gauge on the end.

go for a drive, and get a few WOT runs to obtain readings. my truck, for example, with stock exh. system, produces between 6-7 psi backpressure at WOT above about 4000 rpms.
Old 01-28-2006, 11:05 AM   #41
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

if your going to be tunning and messing with this truck get a gtech unit off ebay the old pro version which uses the same technology as the new one is only like 30 bucks. I have done alot of messing around with them and they have been very accurate and incredibly consistant, i was able to pull 171-174rwhp (25 runs or so) off 5lbs wynjammer, stock i was 126rwhp, now as far as load, wind resistance it doesnt get any more accurate. Also i love how whenever some is talking about hp with a wynjammer there is always this wynjammers don't work undertone almost like were talking about a electric blower off ebay...lol i love it. It might not be the best blower on earth but it does make boost easily, quickly, and cool. these blowers were pushing 500ci mercrusiers holding speed records in the late 80's so i dont think they are going to have problems in a 262ci mini truck.
Old 01-28-2006, 09:40 PM   #42
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote: Originally Posted by MKR
i must have missed it, who made big power with a wynjammer so far?
Wow man, I never said I was makin' big power w/ my setup......I was just expecting to make a little more than what I got.

And once again thanks a bunch for everybody's help, I really appreciate it guys
Old 02-08-2006, 07:34 PM   #43
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Quote: Originally Posted by bagged4life2
Sorry i wrote that wrong... they give consistantly wrong numbers

actually the mustang dynos give consistantly MORE accurate results
Old 02-08-2006, 09:22 PM   #44
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Yep a 3" will flow the heck out of it. A nice Hooker Maxflow in 3" will sound good.
Not too loud at all, unless that's what you want, then a Borla XR-1 race muff or
a Dynomax bullet will work, All are straight thru muffs. Here's a Maxflow pic
courtesy of s10rz350. I run one on my Slonoma. Hardly any resonance in the
cab at all, and a nice fairly deep tone. And you have to admit, this is a pretty
big hole for exhaust to flow out. >

Old 02-08-2006, 09:46 PM   #45
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

**** I've got a 3 inch flowmaster and it made a hell of a difference.....get a 3 inch exhaust asap and possibly some headers and a ypipe.....that'd make a huge difference in your truck
Old 02-09-2006, 05:11 PM   #46
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Yep go 3 inch.. But since you are blown, don't go with a baffled muffler like flowmaster, go with a straight through setup like pictured above..

Jay
Old 02-09-2006, 05:19 PM   #47
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

Yeah I had the flowmaster put on like a year ago, when I had no intentions of installing a supercharger. I'm still in the process of finding a muffler shop w/ a mandrel bender here in Florida that'll make me a custom Y-Pipe....that's the only thing holding me back from replacing my whole exhaust right now.
Old 02-10-2006, 03:10 AM   #48
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

if ur down south enough theres shop here that fabricates all sorts of pipes/bend/weld "Miami Muffler" 305-255-7704 should be the number to call im not sure if they changed it, look em up. They did my y-pipe and full exhaust with magnaflow muffler 1in 2 out with the tips i took to em. Everything is welded, they charged me bout $400 or just under that.
Old 02-27-2006, 07:19 PM   #49
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

it looks like you let off to early on the dyno. It was still making power on both screens you posted. Why such a cut off run? Maybe hitting the speed limiter in 3rd? Why hasnt there been more dyno's with Jammers? I think there good systems.

How loud is the whine?
Old 02-28-2006, 12:07 AM   #50
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Re: Wynjammer Dyno Results...I'm a little disappointed

there will be some dyno numbers in the next week or two on my truck, I have a dyno all lined up thats going to give me 3 runs for 30 or 50 bucks or somthing so once i get the tune all figured out i will be running it and seeing what its got.
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