Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times!

s106banger · 10-09-2008, 12:19 AM

the good news: i did go to the track tuesday night and got 3 runs in, it was way crowded. and you will all have to wait till i scan and post my time slip to see my time...lol.

the bad news: my motor starting to make a knocking sound after my 3rd run, it was late anyways. it has the sound of a lifter but gets louder with a load. i took it to school and we believe its a frozen wrist pin or a cracked piston. it still runs and drives for now, its parked for a while.

more good news: my teacher has a complete 95 4.3 CPI motor with 2250 miles on it that he said he would give me and that we could do the work in class. the plan is to use the short block and bolt everything to it. the CPI motor also has a more agressive cam, a plus for me. we just need to double check a few things to be absolutely sure it will work.

conclusion: im out for the rest of the season...oh well. but the truck should be ready for spring next year if i can come up with some money, and i should have even better times with more reliablity.

ill have videos and pics up asap!

s106banger · 10-09-2008, 01:07 AM

raced my buddies colbalt ss s/c

second run...

13's!!!! raced againist a buddies dodge dart with a built 360!

and a video, i got lazy and didnt upload the other 2, ill do it another day.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RLu1Z0LBHc

Danny_SS · 10-09-2008, 11:15 AM

Very good times, good job! Im sorry to hear about your engine.
I suggest you revise your tuning since I am sure the damage was caused from tuning and not because the engine was making too much power.

s106banger · 10-09-2008, 12:59 PM

ive been looking for some tuning software like hptuners and efi live. but i prob wont have that until the spring, the supercharger will stay off until then.

03xs10 · 10-09-2008, 01:15 PM

Damn great times, congrats!

skafia · 10-09-2008, 01:50 PM

i remember saying 14.1 @ 97 on the other thread...just missed hitting it. great times!!

12sws27 · 10-09-2008, 04:04 PM

That's awesome! I'm inspired.

Now you got me looking for 4:10's and a posi on Ebay

I love how it hooked up. Are you using any kinda traction device? How are you lowered in the rear? Blocks with stock springs? You get any wheelhop?

Danny_SS · 10-09-2008, 05:52 PM

the best most cost effective thing you can do for 4.10:1 rear and posi is to get a rear end off a 2.2 auto s-10 since they bring 4.10's. Then get the Zexel torsen posi off a f-body

Danny_SS · 10-09-2008, 05:53 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by s106banger

ive been looking for some tuning software like hptuners and efi live. but i prob wont have that until the spring, the supercharger will stay off until then.

you can also use a FMU to provide the extra fuel needed.

12sws27 · 10-09-2008, 06:58 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by Danny_SS

the best most cost effective thing you can do for 4.10:1 rear and posi is to get a rear end off a 2.2 auto s-10 since they bring 4.10's. Then get the Zexel torsen posi off a f-body

Yeah I'm watching Ebay now. They'll pop up sooner or later.

s106banger · 10-09-2008, 09:35 PM

the truck hooks great, and i could have pushed it farther too. its lowered 4 3/8" in the rear with blocks and plates to slide my rear back a 1/2". its got stock 4 pack z85 package leafs and i got no wheel hop....lucky me.

i built my rear end for less then 300 bucks.
gears-60
auburn posi-125
premium rebuild kit-110
total-295

make sure you know what your doing when you do it or have a friend that has done it before, i still have some gear noise on decel, but i can live with it. its not exactly a oneday driveway job either.

i feel an FMU is cheating, i would much rather do an edelbrock 2114 swap so i could just up grade injectors and there would be a lot of room for improvement...and it looks cool. i should have the money now to get it running again before december and parked for the winter. if i have enough money after buying a tunning program in the spring ill do the 2114 intake.

12sws27 · 10-10-2008, 12:21 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by s106banger

the truck hooks great, and i could have pushed it farther too. its lowered 4 3/8" in the rear with blocks and plates to slide my rear back a 1/2". its got stock 4 pack z85 package leafs and i got no wheel hop....lucky me.

i built my rear end for less then 300 bucks.
gears-60
auburn posi-125
premium rebuild kit-110
total-295

make sure you know what your doing when you do it or have a friend that has done it before, i still have some gear noise on decel, but i can live with it. its not exactly a oneday driveway job either.

i feel an FMU is cheating, i would much rather do an edelbrock 2114 swap so i could just up grade injectors and there would be a lot of room for improvement...and it looks cool. i should have the money now to get it running again before december and parked for the winter. if i have enough money after buying a tunning program in the spring ill do the 2114 intake.

Cool. Thats good to hear. thats how I had planed on lowering mine. Exept for the set back plates. What's the advantage those have over just angle shims to correct the pinion angle?
If I do the gears and Torson Zexel myself I'll take my time. I might get someone to do it for me though IDK. I'll look into it. Thx for the heads up.
As far as more fuel goes: Why not go with the marine intake? It's alot cheaper. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trkparms=tab%3DWatching&vi ewitem=&item=370095067762&_trksid=p3907.m32

rob8284 · 10-10-2008, 08:52 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by s106banger

...i feel an FMU is cheating, i would much rather do an edelbrock 2114 swap so i could just up grade injectors and there would be a lot of room for improvement...and it looks cool. i should have the money now to get it running again before december and parked for the winter. if i have enough money after buying a tunning program in the spring ill do the 2114 intake.

I'm sorry, but that's a stupid reason for not doing it. I'd rather "cheat" and have an engine that runs well and stays together then have one that goes boom. Plus for under $200 why not? A 2114 swap will cost at least $800, most likely more.

Danny_SS · 10-10-2008, 10:05 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by rob8284

I'm sorry, but that's a stupid reason for not doing it. I'd rather "cheat" and have an engine that runs well and stays together then have one that goes boom. Plus for under $200 why not? A 2114 swap will cost at least $800, most likely more.

exactly
it may not be the best fuel management out there but it not cheating my any means and it gets the job done for very little money. for $200 its tuned where the 2114 will cost over $800-$1000 and you still have to start by tuning it. It is also very easy to tune without the need of any additional computer.

skafia · 10-10-2008, 10:30 AM

wouldnt a bigger fuel pump and preassure regulator do the same thing as an FMU?

rob8284 · 10-10-2008, 10:45 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by skafia

wouldnt a bigger fuel pump and preassure regulator do the same thing as an FMU?

An FMU is a pressure regulator that is boost referenced. When it sees boost, it increases it accordingly (to how it's set up). Depending on how much boost you are running and how much more fuel pressure you need will determine if you need a larger fuel pump or inline pump. If it were me, I'd run an inline fuel pump with an FMU no matter what.

s106banger · 10-11-2008, 01:21 AM

i've been taught do things right and not take short cuts, which is what i did the first time and saw the results. maybe i will reconsider it, that step of the build is still far off anyways. i have A LOT of research ahead of me. the reason i dont like the marine intake manifold is it doesnt have an EGR, how do i pass e-check next year? ive been told they look for the EGR, but i could have been told wrong.

if i can do anything with my current motor, the one thats knocking, i will begin an indepth build. with forged internals, a good cam, some very well ported vortec heads, and some actual MPI setup. so i figure if i do the 2114 now then ill be that much more ready down the line, but at this point i may not be capiable of doing it either. i have a lot to consider before i go to the track again and before i start buying stuff.

s106banger · 10-11-2008, 01:26 AM

oh, and the point of the set-back plates were to keep the drive shaft out of the trans. when you put drop blocks in that big it moves the axle forward too. its a good way to kill a bearing. when i dropped my truck we tried to move the drive shaft front to back and it had zero movement, so i asked my dad to make some plates for me at work, and all better.

12sws27 · 10-11-2008, 06:32 PM

Oh ok, so the set back plates do the same as correcting the pinion angle with the angled shims. I was just wondering if you or anyone had opinions on which is better. That's a little off topic anyways. The 2114 doesn't have egr. You can have egr with the marine set up though. That's one of the reasons some prefer it over the 2114. The down side of the marine intake is the wieght. Check out this wright up.
http://www.pacificp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=317

rob8284 · 10-12-2008, 02:57 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by s106banger

i've been taught do things right and not take short cuts, which is what i did the first time and saw the results. maybe i will reconsider it, that step of the build is still far off anyways. i have A LOT of research ahead of me. the reason i dont like the marine intake manifold is it doesnt have an EGR, how do i pass e-check next year? ive been told they look for the EGR, but i could have been told wrong...

There is nothing wrong with using an FMU. And I wouldn't consider it being the "wrong" way for a set up running around 12psi or so. Supercharged set ups seem to have less problems with FMU's then turbos from what I've read/seen.

Are you talking about a visual inspection? If it's just an emissions test, you can have EGR tuned out.

skafia · 10-12-2008, 06:14 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by rob8284

There is nothing wrong with using an FMU. And I wouldn't consider it being the "wrong" way for a set up running around 12psi or so. Supercharged set ups seem to have less problems with FMU's then turbos from what I've read/seen.

Are you talking about a visual inspection? If it's just an emissions test, you can have EGR tuned out.

i think the problem with using am FMU with a turbo is that a turbo spools much quicker once the exhaust is built up than a supercharger that spools with the crank pulley set up. The FMU doesnt have the time to supply the fuel to the turbo while the FMU for the supercharger adds fuel more quickly/efficently since boost is controlled by the pullies. im probably wrong but i hope not, im trying to catch on to this whole "boost" thing

s106banger · 10-12-2008, 09:43 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by 12sws27

Oh ok, so the set back plates do the same as correcting the pinion angle with the angled shims. I was just wondering if you or anyone had opinions on which is better. That's a little off topic anyways. The 2114 doesn't have egr. You can have egr with the marine set up though. That's one of the reasons some prefer it over the 2114. The down side of the marine intake is the wieght. Check out this wright up.
http://www.pacificp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=317

no, set-back plates dont correct the pinion angle.

wow, i was off the whole intake thing i guess.

s106banger · 10-12-2008, 09:50 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by rob8284

There is nothing wrong with using an FMU. And I wouldn't consider it being the "wrong" way for a set up running around 12psi or so. Supercharged set ups seem to have less problems with FMU's then turbos from what I've read/seen.

Are you talking about a visual inspection? If it's just an emissions test, you can have EGR tuned out.

well ive tossed around the idea of an FMU and its starting to grow on me. the more i think about it the more simple and straight forward it is. how do you tune with it though? do they make an adjustable FMU? i saw in the summit magazine that vortech has one that will maintain a 10.5-11.8 (i think) a/f ratio. i have no idea were i should be at for an a/r ratio with my little 6lbs of boost and supporting mods... i guess to much fuel wouldnt be the worst thing.

a tuning program isnt looking promising now either, i dont have a laptop. i had planed to get one for christmas, but thats changed now. would a tune just for me from pcmforless still work with the FMU?

s106banger · 10-12-2008, 09:52 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by skafia

i think the problem with using am FMU with a turbo is that a turbo spools much quicker once the exhaust is built up than a supercharger that spools with the crank pulley set up. The FMU doesnt have the time to supply the fuel to the turbo while the FMU for the supercharger adds fuel more quickly/efficently since boost is controlled by the pullies. im probably wrong but i hope not, im trying to catch on to this whole "boost" thing

your theory makes sense to me...

and summits scratch and dent sale is next weekend. you gonna go?

skafia · 10-13-2008, 12:12 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by s106banger

your theory makes sense to me...

and summits scratch and dent sale is next weekend. you gonna go?

i have the vortech 12:1 FMU i dont think its adjustable youd need to buy a recalibration kit for it if you needed to add more fuel (which i might need to do...)

is it this weekend???? i need performance front end bushings. my control arm bushings are shot from being lowered and their squeakin like a bitch!!! i might go friday if the sale starts then because i need a new -4 hose end fitting since i broke mine tightening it in the hose. $8 of anodized aluminum down the drain...and no place around here sells them!!

12sws27 · 10-13-2008, 12:40 AM

Just get them to tune your PCM. I'm running 6psi and dont need a FMU. No pinging with mine. I've pulled and read the plugs several times and I dont have a problem. If you ever go the marine intake route you wont need a FMU. I'm not against FMU's or anything. If I was in the situation where I needed more fuel I might use 1 myself.

Danny_SS · 10-13-2008, 11:27 AM

Quote: Originally Posted by skafia

i think the problem with using am FMU with a turbo is that a turbo spools much quicker once the exhaust is built up than a supercharger that spools with the crank pulley set up. The FMU doesnt have the time to supply the fuel to the turbo while the FMU for the supercharger adds fuel more quickly/efficently since boost is controlled by the pullies. im probably wrong but i hope not, im trying to catch on to this whole "boost" thing

Not exactly. The reason why FMUs work better on engines with centrifugal SC tha non engines with turbos is that boost on centrifugal SC is RPM dependent since it is ran off the pulleys. You get full boost at redline only. On Turbos boost is NOT proportional to RPM since you can get full boost at pretty much any rpm depending on load. It is typical that you can see full boost at 3,000 RPM all the way to redline. The FMU raises fuel pressure according to boost but the fuel consumption is not the same at 3k RPM than at redline therefore if the FMU is tuned to give you a proper A/F ratio at redline your engine will run VERY rich at 3,000 RPM- just before redline. Vise versa if you tune for proper A/F at 3,000 you will be very lean at redline. Obviously it is better to tune for proper redline A/F and run rich everywhere under the redline.
That is not really an issue with censtrifugal SC though since you will allways have the same boost at a given RPM with the centrifugal SC.

the ratio that you see shown on the FMU is the rise in fuel pressure per LB of boost. It is not the actual A/F ratio. YOu will calculate your fuel requirements and choose your FMU accordingly. YOu can also start with one that you know will make you run rich and get calibration kits to work your way down.

no changes need to be made to your PCM or ECU in order to properly run the FMU.

rob8284 · 10-13-2008, 01:25 PM

Quote: Originally Posted by s106banger

well ive tossed around the idea of an FMU and its starting to grow on me. the more i think about it the more simple and straight forward it is. how do you tune with it though? do they make an adjustable FMU? i saw in the summit magazine that vortech has one that will maintain a 10.5-11.8 (i think) a/f ratio. i have no idea were i should be at for an a/r ratio with my little 6lbs of boost and supporting mods... i guess to much fuel wouldnt be the worst thing...

Quote: Originally Posted by skafia

i have the vortech 12:1 FMU i dont think its adjustable youd need to buy a recalibration kit for it if you needed to add more fuel (which i might need to do...)...

This is what you should run: http://www.bellengineering.net/produ...&products_id=4

It is adjustable and you do not need a "calibration" kit for it.

Quote: Originally Posted by Danny_SS

...no changes need to be made to your PCM or ECU in order to properly run the FMU.

You do not NEED to, but having the PCM programed to fuel up to a certain boost level and having the FMU take over the rest isn't a bad idea.

Danny_SS · 10-13-2008, 01:32 PM

[quote=

You do not NEED to, but having the PCM programed to fuel up to a certain boost level and having the FMU take over the rest isn't a bad idea.[/quote]

i believe he has the PCM programmed to take care of boost till about 6-8 psi. after that the FMU will take care of the rest. some minor tweaking will be beneficial since with the FMU he will get a bit more gas than he was getting throughout the rpm range.

skafia · 10-13-2008, 02:37 PM

[quote=Danny_SS;5654906]Not exactly. The reason why FMUs work better on engines with centrifugal SC tha non engines with turbos is that boost on centrifugal SC is RPM dependent since it is ran off the pulleys. You get full boost at redline only. On Turbos boost is NOT proportional to RPM since you can get full boost at pretty much any rpm depending on load. It is typical that you can see full boost at 3,000 RPM all the way to redline. The FMU raises fuel pressure according to boost but the fuel consumption is not the same at 3k RPM than at redline therefore if the FMU is tuned to give you a proper A/F ratio at redline your engine will run VERY rich at 3,000 RPM- just before redline. Vise versa if you tune for proper A/F at 3,000 you will be very lean at redline. Obviously it is better to tune for proper redline A/F and run rich everywhere under the redline.
That is not really an issue with censtrifugal SC though since you will allways have the same boost at a given RPM with the centrifugal SC....quote]

thank you for adding on to my theory..i left out full boosting with turbos and FMU raising the fuel pressure

10-09-2008, 12:19 AM	#1
s106banger i need a paint job Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 632 Location: medina User is: OffLine	Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! the good news: i did go to the track tuesday night and got 3 runs in, it was way crowded. and you will all have to wait till i scan and post my time slip to see my time...lol. the bad news: my motor starting to make a knocking sound after my 3rd run, it was late anyways. it has the sound of a lifter but gets louder with a load. i took it to school and we believe its a frozen wrist pin or a cracked piston. it still runs and drives for now, its parked for a while. more good news: my teacher has a complete 95 4.3 CPI motor with 2250 miles on it that he said he would give me and that we could do the work in class. the plan is to use the short block and bolt everything to it. the CPI motor also has a more agressive cam, a plus for me. we just need to double check a few things to be absolutely sure it will work. conclusion: im out for the rest of the season...oh well. but the truck should be ready for spring next year if i can come up with some money, and i should have even better times with more reliablity. ill have videos and pics up asap!
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-09-2008, 01:07 AM	#2
s106banger i need a paint job Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 632 Location: medina User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! raced my buddies colbalt ss s/c second run... 13's!!!! raced againist a buddies dodge dart with a built 360! and a video, i got lazy and didnt upload the other 2, ill do it another day. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9RLu1Z0LBHc
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-09-2008, 11:15 AM	#3
Danny_SS Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 199 Location: User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Very good times, good job! Im sorry to hear about your engine. I suggest you revise your tuning since I am sure the damage was caused from tuning and not because the engine was making too much power.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-09-2008, 12:59 PM	#4
s106banger i need a paint job Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 632 Location: medina User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! ive been looking for some tuning software like hptuners and efi live. but i prob wont have that until the spring, the supercharger will stay off until then.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-09-2008, 01:15 PM	#5
03xs10 low "N" slo Age: 21 Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 176 Location: maryland User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Damn great times, congrats!
	[Reply w/Quote]


S10Forum is the premier S-Series Site on the internet. Registered Users do not see the above ads. Please Register - It's Free!

10-09-2008, 01:50 PM	#6
skafia Registered User Age: 19 Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 162 Location: User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! i remember saying 14.1 @ 97 on the other thread...just missed hitting it. great times!!
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-09-2008, 04:04 PM	#7
12sws27 Registered User Age: 33 Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 308 Location: Miami,FL User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! That's awesome! I'm inspired. Now you got me looking for 4:10's and a posi on Ebay I love how it hooked up. Are you using any kinda traction device? How are you lowered in the rear? Blocks with stock springs? You get any wheelhop?
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-09-2008, 05:52 PM	#8
Danny_SS Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 199 Location: User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! the best most cost effective thing you can do for 4.10:1 rear and posi is to get a rear end off a 2.2 auto s-10 since they bring 4.10's. Then get the Zexel torsen posi off a f-body
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-09-2008, 05:53 PM	#9
Danny_SS Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 199 Location: User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by s106banger ive been looking for some tuning software like hptuners and efi live. but i prob wont have that until the spring, the supercharger will stay off until then. you can also use a FMU to provide the extra fuel needed.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-09-2008, 06:58 PM	#10
12sws27 Registered User Age: 33 Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 308 Location: Miami,FL User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by Danny_SS the best most cost effective thing you can do for 4.10:1 rear and posi is to get a rear end off a 2.2 auto s-10 since they bring 4.10's. Then get the Zexel torsen posi off a f-body Yeah I'm watching Ebay now. They'll pop up sooner or later.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-09-2008, 09:35 PM	#11
s106banger i need a paint job Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 632 Location: medina User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! the truck hooks great, and i could have pushed it farther too. its lowered 4 3/8" in the rear with blocks and plates to slide my rear back a 1/2". its got stock 4 pack z85 package leafs and i got no wheel hop....lucky me. i built my rear end for less then 300 bucks. gears-60 auburn posi-125 premium rebuild kit-110 total-295 make sure you know what your doing when you do it or have a friend that has done it before, i still have some gear noise on decel, but i can live with it. its not exactly a oneday driveway job either. i feel an FMU is cheating, i would much rather do an edelbrock 2114 swap so i could just up grade injectors and there would be a lot of room for improvement...and it looks cool. i should have the money now to get it running again before december and parked for the winter. if i have enough money after buying a tunning program in the spring ill do the 2114 intake.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-10-2008, 12:21 AM	#12
12sws27 Registered User Age: 33 Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 308 Location: Miami,FL User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by s106banger the truck hooks great, and i could have pushed it farther too. its lowered 4 3/8" in the rear with blocks and plates to slide my rear back a 1/2". its got stock 4 pack z85 package leafs and i got no wheel hop....lucky me. i built my rear end for less then 300 bucks. gears-60 auburn posi-125 premium rebuild kit-110 total-295 make sure you know what your doing when you do it or have a friend that has done it before, i still have some gear noise on decel, but i can live with it. its not exactly a oneday driveway job either. i feel an FMU is cheating, i would much rather do an edelbrock 2114 swap so i could just up grade injectors and there would be a lot of room for improvement...and it looks cool. i should have the money now to get it running again before december and parked for the winter. if i have enough money after buying a tunning program in the spring ill do the 2114 intake. Cool. Thats good to hear. thats how I had planed on lowering mine. Exept for the set back plates. What's the advantage those have over just angle shims to correct the pinion angle? If I do the gears and Torson Zexel myself I'll take my time. I might get someone to do it for me though IDK. I'll look into it. Thx for the heads up. As far as more fuel goes: Why not go with the marine intake? It's alot cheaper. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&_trkparms=tab%3DWatching&vi ewitem=&item=370095067762&_trksid=p3907.m32
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-10-2008, 08:52 AM	#13
rob8284 Registered User Age: 24 Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 359 Location: Westminster, MD User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by s106banger ...i feel an FMU is cheating, i would much rather do an edelbrock 2114 swap so i could just up grade injectors and there would be a lot of room for improvement...and it looks cool. i should have the money now to get it running again before december and parked for the winter. if i have enough money after buying a tunning program in the spring ill do the 2114 intake. I'm sorry, but that's a stupid reason for not doing it. I'd rather "cheat" and have an engine that runs well and stays together then have one that goes boom. Plus for under $200 why not? A 2114 swap will cost at least $800, most likely more. Last edited by rob8284 : 10-10-2008 at 08:53 AM.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-10-2008, 10:05 AM	#14
Danny_SS Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 199 Location: User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by rob8284 I'm sorry, but that's a stupid reason for not doing it. I'd rather "cheat" and have an engine that runs well and stays together then have one that goes boom. Plus for under $200 why not? A 2114 swap will cost at least $800, most likely more. exactly it may not be the best fuel management out there but it not cheating my any means and it gets the job done for very little money. for $200 its tuned where the 2114 will cost over $800-$1000 and you still have to start by tuning it. It is also very easy to tune without the need of any additional computer.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-10-2008, 10:30 AM	#15
skafia Registered User Age: 19 Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 162 Location: User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! wouldnt a bigger fuel pump and preassure regulator do the same thing as an FMU?
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-10-2008, 10:45 AM	#16
rob8284 Registered User Age: 24 Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 359 Location: Westminster, MD User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by skafia wouldnt a bigger fuel pump and preassure regulator do the same thing as an FMU? An FMU is a pressure regulator that is boost referenced. When it sees boost, it increases it accordingly (to how it's set up). Depending on how much boost you are running and how much more fuel pressure you need will determine if you need a larger fuel pump or inline pump. If it were me, I'd run an inline fuel pump with an FMU no matter what.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-11-2008, 01:21 AM	#17
s106banger i need a paint job Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 632 Location: medina User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! i've been taught do things right and not take short cuts, which is what i did the first time and saw the results. maybe i will reconsider it, that step of the build is still far off anyways. i have A LOT of research ahead of me. the reason i dont like the marine intake manifold is it doesnt have an EGR, how do i pass e-check next year? ive been told they look for the EGR, but i could have been told wrong. if i can do anything with my current motor, the one thats knocking, i will begin an indepth build. with forged internals, a good cam, some very well ported vortec heads, and some actual MPI setup. so i figure if i do the 2114 now then ill be that much more ready down the line, but at this point i may not be capiable of doing it either. i have a lot to consider before i go to the track again and before i start buying stuff.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-11-2008, 01:26 AM	#18
s106banger i need a paint job Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 632 Location: medina User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! oh, and the point of the set-back plates were to keep the drive shaft out of the trans. when you put drop blocks in that big it moves the axle forward too. its a good way to kill a bearing. when i dropped my truck we tried to move the drive shaft front to back and it had zero movement, so i asked my dad to make some plates for me at work, and all better.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-11-2008, 06:32 PM	#19
12sws27 Registered User Age: 33 Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 308 Location: Miami,FL User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Oh ok, so the set back plates do the same as correcting the pinion angle with the angled shims. I was just wondering if you or anyone had opinions on which is better. That's a little off topic anyways. The 2114 doesn't have egr. You can have egr with the marine set up though. That's one of the reasons some prefer it over the 2114. The down side of the marine intake is the wieght. Check out this wright up. http://www.pacificp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=317
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-12-2008, 02:57 PM	#20
rob8284 Registered User Age: 24 Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 359 Location: Westminster, MD User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by s106banger i've been taught do things right and not take short cuts, which is what i did the first time and saw the results. maybe i will reconsider it, that step of the build is still far off anyways. i have A LOT of research ahead of me. the reason i dont like the marine intake manifold is it doesnt have an EGR, how do i pass e-check next year? ive been told they look for the EGR, but i could have been told wrong... There is nothing wrong with using an FMU. And I wouldn't consider it being the "wrong" way for a set up running around 12psi or so. Supercharged set ups seem to have less problems with FMU's then turbos from what I've read/seen. Are you talking about a visual inspection? If it's just an emissions test, you can have EGR tuned out.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-12-2008, 06:14 PM	#21
skafia Registered User Age: 19 Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 162 Location: User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by rob8284 There is nothing wrong with using an FMU. And I wouldn't consider it being the "wrong" way for a set up running around 12psi or so. Supercharged set ups seem to have less problems with FMU's then turbos from what I've read/seen. Are you talking about a visual inspection? If it's just an emissions test, you can have EGR tuned out. i think the problem with using am FMU with a turbo is that a turbo spools much quicker once the exhaust is built up than a supercharger that spools with the crank pulley set up. The FMU doesnt have the time to supply the fuel to the turbo while the FMU for the supercharger adds fuel more quickly/efficently since boost is controlled by the pullies. im probably wrong but i hope not, im trying to catch on to this whole "boost" thing
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-12-2008, 09:43 PM	#22
s106banger i need a paint job Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 632 Location: medina User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by 12sws27 Oh ok, so the set back plates do the same as correcting the pinion angle with the angled shims. I was just wondering if you or anyone had opinions on which is better. That's a little off topic anyways. The 2114 doesn't have egr. You can have egr with the marine set up though. That's one of the reasons some prefer it over the 2114. The down side of the marine intake is the wieght. Check out this wright up. http://www.pacificp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=317 no, set-back plates dont correct the pinion angle. wow, i was off the whole intake thing i guess.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-12-2008, 09:50 PM	#23
s106banger i need a paint job Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 632 Location: medina User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by rob8284 There is nothing wrong with using an FMU. And I wouldn't consider it being the "wrong" way for a set up running around 12psi or so. Supercharged set ups seem to have less problems with FMU's then turbos from what I've read/seen. Are you talking about a visual inspection? If it's just an emissions test, you can have EGR tuned out. well ive tossed around the idea of an FMU and its starting to grow on me. the more i think about it the more simple and straight forward it is. how do you tune with it though? do they make an adjustable FMU? i saw in the summit magazine that vortech has one that will maintain a 10.5-11.8 (i think) a/f ratio. i have no idea were i should be at for an a/r ratio with my little 6lbs of boost and supporting mods... i guess to much fuel wouldnt be the worst thing. a tuning program isnt looking promising now either, i dont have a laptop. i had planed to get one for christmas, but thats changed now. would a tune just for me from pcmforless still work with the FMU? Last edited by s106banger : 10-12-2008 at 09:51 PM.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-12-2008, 09:52 PM	#24
s106banger i need a paint job Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 632 Location: medina User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by skafia i think the problem with using am FMU with a turbo is that a turbo spools much quicker once the exhaust is built up than a supercharger that spools with the crank pulley set up. The FMU doesnt have the time to supply the fuel to the turbo while the FMU for the supercharger adds fuel more quickly/efficently since boost is controlled by the pullies. im probably wrong but i hope not, im trying to catch on to this whole "boost" thing your theory makes sense to me... and summits scratch and dent sale is next weekend. you gonna go?
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-13-2008, 12:12 AM	#25
skafia Registered User Age: 19 Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 162 Location: User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by s106banger your theory makes sense to me... and summits scratch and dent sale is next weekend. you gonna go? i have the vortech 12:1 FMU i dont think its adjustable youd need to buy a recalibration kit for it if you needed to add more fuel (which i might need to do...) is it this weekend???? i need performance front end bushings. my control arm bushings are shot from being lowered and their squeakin like a bitch!!! i might go friday if the sale starts then because i need a new -4 hose end fitting since i broke mine tightening it in the hose. $8 of anodized aluminum down the drain...and no place around here sells them!!
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-13-2008, 12:40 AM	#26
12sws27 Registered User Age: 33 Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 308 Location: Miami,FL User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Just get them to tune your PCM. I'm running 6psi and dont need a FMU. No pinging with mine. I've pulled and read the plugs several times and I dont have a problem. If you ever go the marine intake route you wont need a FMU. I'm not against FMU's or anything. If I was in the situation where I needed more fuel I might use 1 myself.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-13-2008, 11:27 AM	#27
Danny_SS Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 199 Location: User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by skafia i think the problem with using am FMU with a turbo is that a turbo spools much quicker once the exhaust is built up than a supercharger that spools with the crank pulley set up. The FMU doesnt have the time to supply the fuel to the turbo while the FMU for the supercharger adds fuel more quickly/efficently since boost is controlled by the pullies. im probably wrong but i hope not, im trying to catch on to this whole "boost" thing Not exactly. The reason why FMUs work better on engines with centrifugal SC tha non engines with turbos is that boost on centrifugal SC is RPM dependent since it is ran off the pulleys. You get full boost at redline only. On Turbos boost is NOT proportional to RPM since you can get full boost at pretty much any rpm depending on load. It is typical that you can see full boost at 3,000 RPM all the way to redline. The FMU raises fuel pressure according to boost but the fuel consumption is not the same at 3k RPM than at redline therefore if the FMU is tuned to give you a proper A/F ratio at redline your engine will run VERY rich at 3,000 RPM- just before redline. Vise versa if you tune for proper A/F at 3,000 you will be very lean at redline. Obviously it is better to tune for proper redline A/F and run rich everywhere under the redline. That is not really an issue with censtrifugal SC though since you will allways have the same boost at a given RPM with the centrifugal SC. the ratio that you see shown on the FMU is the rise in fuel pressure per LB of boost. It is not the actual A/F ratio. YOu will calculate your fuel requirements and choose your FMU accordingly. YOu can also start with one that you know will make you run rich and get calibration kits to work your way down. no changes need to be made to your PCM or ECU in order to properly run the FMU.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-13-2008, 01:25 PM	#28
rob8284 Registered User Age: 24 Join Date: Feb 2005 Posts: 359 Location: Westminster, MD User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! Quote: Originally Posted by s106banger well ive tossed around the idea of an FMU and its starting to grow on me. the more i think about it the more simple and straight forward it is. how do you tune with it though? do they make an adjustable FMU? i saw in the summit magazine that vortech has one that will maintain a 10.5-11.8 (i think) a/f ratio. i have no idea were i should be at for an a/r ratio with my little 6lbs of boost and supporting mods... i guess to much fuel wouldnt be the worst thing... Quote: Originally Posted by skafia i have the vortech 12:1 FMU i dont think its adjustable youd need to buy a recalibration kit for it if you needed to add more fuel (which i might need to do...)... This is what you should run: http://www.bellengineering.net/produ...&products_id=4 It is adjustable and you do not need a "calibration" kit for it. Quote: Originally Posted by Danny_SS ...no changes need to be made to your PCM or ECU in order to properly run the FMU. You do not NEED to, but having the PCM programed to fuel up to a certain boost level and having the FMU take over the rest isn't a bad idea.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-13-2008, 01:32 PM	#29
Danny_SS Registered User Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 199 Location: User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! [quote= You do not NEED to, but having the PCM programed to fuel up to a certain boost level and having the FMU take over the rest isn't a bad idea.[/quote] i believe he has the PCM programmed to take care of boost till about 6-8 psi. after that the FMU will take care of the rest. some minor tweaking will be beneficial since with the FMU he will get a bit more gas than he was getting throughout the rpm range.
	[Reply w/Quote]

10-13-2008, 02:37 PM	#30
skafia Registered User Age: 19 Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 162 Location: User is: OffLine	Re: Wynjammer 1/4 Mile Track Times! [quote=Danny_SS;5654906]Not exactly. The reason why FMUs work better on engines with centrifugal SC tha non engines with turbos is that boost on centrifugal SC is RPM dependent since it is ran off the pulleys. You get full boost at redline only. On Turbos boost is NOT proportional to RPM since you can get full boost at pretty much any rpm depending on load. It is typical that you can see full boost at 3,000 RPM all the way to redline. The FMU raises fuel pressure according to boost but the fuel consumption is not the same at 3k RPM than at redline therefore if the FMU is tuned to give you a proper A/F ratio at redline your engine will run VERY rich at 3,000 RPM- just before redline. Vise versa if you tune for proper A/F at 3,000 you will be very lean at redline. Obviously it is better to tune for proper redline A/F and run rich everywhere under the redline. That is not really an issue with censtrifugal SC though since you will allways have the same boost at a given RPM with the centrifugal SC....quote] thank you for adding on to my theory..i left out full boosting with turbos and FMU raising the fuel pressure
	[Reply w/Quote]