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Reuse Bearings??

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Old 12-30-2010, 11:20 PM   #1
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Reuse Bearings??

OK, my question is....

If I were to remove the rod/main caps to check the bearings on an engine just to make sure the bearings are ok, can I just re-torque them if everything is ok and use the engine???

Or will I need to replace them??
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Old 12-30-2010, 11:32 PM   #2
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

personally I would replace them not a good idea to re use bearings you would be risking alot. they arent that much so do i would replace them. imo
Old 12-31-2010, 12:36 AM   #3
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

I'm with custom.....
Old 12-31-2010, 12:40 AM   #4
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

scratch do up there it will sound little better. lol
Old 12-31-2010, 12:42 AM   #5
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

;-)
Old 12-31-2010, 02:01 AM   #6
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

The only reason I ask is that I will more than likley be getting a used engine with around 90k miles on it. Just to be safe I was wanting to check things out. Or should I just run it.....I have decided not to rebuild my other engine seeing how I dont have the money to do it "right", right now but, I do have the money for this engine.

My other engine will need a cam, cam bearings, main bearings, crank turned, rod bearings, timing set, oil pump, lifters, water pump, plugs, wires, rotor, cap and at least one rod and one piston and might also need to be bored out then that would be 6 pistons. With out the pistons that will be around 600 bucks with them it will be another 150....the engine I can get is 375 and is out of a running truck..
Old 12-31-2010, 02:49 AM   #7
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

my personal opinion is if it is a running engine and its temporary at best
don't touch it just put it in and run it till your other engine is ready.
Old 12-31-2010, 11:02 AM   #8
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

does the used engine have good oil pressure ? that will tell you a lot about the bearings also warmed up pressure is more important
Old 12-31-2010, 11:36 AM   #9
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Quote: Originally Posted by crash55
does the used engine have good oil pressure ? that will tell you a lot about the bearings also warmed up pressure is more important
Good question.....the engine was removed about 2 months ago....the best I could do would be a compression test....then install it and run it to see if it has good oil pressure, alot of work I know, but I don't have the means to run it on a engine stand. I will ask the guy and see if it had good oil pressure...kind of a crap shoot, but I will see what he says.
Old 12-31-2010, 12:19 PM   #10
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Depending on your future plans and current situation, you could either just throw it in...or do a light pm as we did-1yr.25k still perfect.threw it on a stand, new crank & rod bearings, oil pump, full reseal w/front timing cover.
On this 1 we used all parts from Advance auto using their 40% off codes
Old 12-31-2010, 01:28 PM   #11
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

No advance auto close to me here.....but, next to my father-in-law in OKC there is....what brand parts did you use??? And what was the cost??

I am thinking of getting some king bearings, melling oil pump, freeze plugs and cloyes timing set....not sure yet.
Old 12-31-2010, 03:23 PM   #12
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

What 40% off codes....
Old 12-31-2010, 03:47 PM   #13
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Quote: Originally Posted by lesterl
What 40% off codes....
they have the 40% ad right here on this site as well as other places too.
Save up to
Use Code in Shopping Cart
15%
EMW53 - ($5 off $30 or more)
25%
EMW14 - ($10 off $40 or more)
40%
EMW25 - ($20 off orders over $50)
40%
EMW37 - ($30 off orders over $75)
25%
EMW41 - ($40 off orders over $100)
25%
EMW52 - ($50 off orders over $200)
20%
EMW20 - (20% off all orders – no minimum)
or
$15 BIG5 - ($5 off $15 or more) 33%
$25 BIG10 - ($10 off $25 or more) 40%
$50 A123 - ($20 off $50 or more) 40%
$75 BIG30 - ($30 off orders over $75) 40%
$100 BIG40 - ($40 off orders over $100) 40%
$200 BIG50 - ($50 off orders over $200) 25%
ANY P20 - (20% off all orders - no minimum) 20%
Old 12-31-2010, 03:55 PM   #14
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Quote: Originally Posted by Lyric
No advance auto close to me here.....but, next to my father-in-law in OKC there is....what brand parts did you use??? And what was the cost??

I am thinking of getting some king bearings, melling oil pump, freeze plugs and cloyes timing set....not sure yet.
what ever type they sell, I think sealed power. you could always call and ask. I used a melling on a couple of mine and felpro gaskets though you really want to use the felpro Pro intake set due to possible issues....break up your orders to just past the coupon threshhold min.too.It's all about maximizing your purchasing power!
Old 12-31-2010, 06:56 PM   #15
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Those good for online purchases too???

Sorry, If I would learn how to read I could have saved myself some embarrassment.
Old 12-31-2010, 09:26 PM   #16
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Online, yes but you can always choose in-store pickup which I always have done. This way too, you always have receipts/history at your finger tips! sometimes you may have to clear the cookie and cache from your browser when using same discount code multiple times
Old 01-01-2011, 11:31 AM   #17
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

IMO why build this engine when you want to build another engine. IMO it would be a waste.

At the very least I would do a reseal of oil pan, rear main, valve covers and intake and put her in. You will have less than 100 in doing that.
Old 01-01-2011, 11:38 AM   #18
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Us old timer geezer types used to: Yank the distributor and oil pressure sender, put a gauge on the sender port, and spin the oil pump shaft with something attached to a drill. Let it build to max pressure then see how long the pressure holds after you stop the drill. Does 2 things: pre-oils everything, and if the bearings are pretty good it will hold pressure for at least 30 seconds.
Old 01-01-2011, 10:58 PM   #19
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

good idea. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Old 01-02-2011, 02:22 PM   #20
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Quote: Originally Posted by pioresko
Us old timer geezer types used to: Yank the distributor and oil pressure sender, put a gauge on the sender port, and spin the oil pump shaft with something attached to a drill. Let it build to max pressure then see how long the pressure holds after you stop the drill. Does 2 things: pre-oils everything, and if the bearings are pretty good it will hold pressure for at least 30 seconds.
you are not suppose to devulge classified material lol
Old 01-02-2011, 05:05 PM   #21
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Quote: Originally Posted by pioresko
Us old timer geezer types used to: Yank the distributor and oil pressure sender, put a gauge on the sender port, and spin the oil pump shaft with something attached to a drill. Let it build to max pressure then see how long the pressure holds after you stop the drill. Does 2 things: pre-oils everything, and if the bearings are pretty good it will hold pressure for at least 30 seconds.
Ok, if and when I do this, the oil cooler lines are still attached to the filter housing and the engine is on my engine stand and should I plug them or???

I have an old oil pump drive shaft could I use that??
Old 01-02-2011, 05:09 PM   #22
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

dont plug them. loop them together with a hose. If you plug them you wont get oil thru the engine.
Old 01-02-2011, 05:13 PM   #23
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Oh, just to let you all know I went ahead and bought the engine, as I was looking it over I noticed that the previous owner had changed the whole dist. assembly, wires, EGR valve, and the oil cooler lines.

So, I am hoping that they did regular maintenance on the engine...I looked at the vehicle and looked over the interior and it was in really good shape.... aside from the damage from the of the accident, the overall truck looked good....the engine bay was pretty clean and the only signs of oil leakage was on the driver-side by the control arm...oil cooler lines?? other than that all looked good....I will be doing a compression test either today or tomorrow and will post results.
Old 01-02-2011, 05:14 PM   #24
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Quote: Originally Posted by S15vortecpwr
dont plug them. loop them together with a hose. If you plug them you wont get oil thru the engine.
Ok...thanks.

Will the old oil pump drive shaft work?? Chucked up to my drill??
Old 01-02-2011, 07:30 PM   #25
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

you will need an oil priming device to take the place
of the distributor in order to prime/test the engine.

some people have tried it without the priming tool,
and i have seen oil pump and driveshaft damage
occur from it.
plus, without the tool, your oil pressure test results
will be meaningless because there will be a large hole
in pass. side lifter gallery, which will allow a rapid
drop in pressure.

the distributor or priming tool seals this gallery when installed.
Old 01-02-2011, 08:07 PM   #26
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Quote: Originally Posted by Crew Cab Sonoma
you will need an oil priming device to take the place
of the distributor in order to prime/test the engine.

some people have tried it without the priming tool,
and i have seen oil pump and driveshaft damage
occur from it.
plus, without the tool, your oil pressure test results
will be meaningless because there will be a large hole
in pass. side lifter gallery, which will allow a rapid
drop in pressure.

the distributor or priming tool seals this gallery when installed.
Ok, Thanks.

Here are some pics of the engine from the salvage yard....Pulled the valve cover and it is surprisingly clean in here....It has a couple small leaks that are not dripping yet, I think I will put all new gaskets on and install it this coming weekend, if the weather is nice.

Sorry they are a little blurry.










Old 01-02-2011, 08:12 PM   #27
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

She's pretty clean dude, good find..... I would give $375 for that motor anyday...... Low miles right? Dude you got a deal looks like......
Old 01-02-2011, 08:43 PM   #28
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Quote: Originally Posted by lesterl
She's pretty clean dude, good find..... I would give $375 for that motor anyday...... Low miles right? Dude you got a deal looks like......
Well, he said a little over 100K when I went to pick it up I looked at the truck that it came out of and it said 164K on the Odometer....I got it for 350 cause that is not a little over that is quite a bit over.

But, none the less I think it is going to be a good engine.
Old 01-02-2011, 08:49 PM   #29
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Shure looks like he took care of it. I wouldnt be that afraid of it myself. The little deception kinda bugs me, but maybe it was a crate motor? I have had a couple that I got rid of before 250k still running strong and without using oil...... Good Luck Man!!!!
Old 01-02-2011, 09:00 PM   #30
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Thanks....he seemed like a nice guy...but I have a friend who is a local cop and I asked if he could run the vin, that way I could call the previous owner and ask him about the engine...I have to wait until tomorrow though....hopefully the guy is cool about me asking questions.

The guy at the salvage yard said he walked away with just some minor cuts and scrapes.
Old 01-03-2011, 11:33 AM   #31
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

not sure on contacting previous owner due to method but engine looks nice!
Yea..now's the time to get 'er done!
Old 01-03-2011, 12:59 PM   #32
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Quote: Originally Posted by Bills Dad
not sure on contacting previous owner due to method but engine looks nice!
Yea..now's the time to get 'er done!
Due to method??
Old 01-03-2011, 11:08 PM   #33
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

seems a cop could get in trouble for getting info? anyways, good luck!
Old 01-04-2011, 03:35 PM   #34
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Well, it seems that this engine will be in my blazer for as long as it will last...so, I am wondering which timing set would be best.

Cloyes or Comp Cams???

Since I will be replacing all the gaskets...might as well do the timing set right??
Old 01-04-2011, 05:26 PM   #35
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

I'm gonna address the original question.

Why would you pull the bearings unless you have a knock at cold start ?
Some of the 80's GM 5.7's had a knock at hot start which a PF-1218 oil filter with a check valve[from a 1980 Trans Am Turbo]

A standard bearing check is done with Plastigauge.
It's a tiny stick of plastic, placed across the bearing surface, torqued down, removed and compared to the chart on the package.
[do NOT rotate the motor with plastigauge in the brg]

http://www.plastigaugeusa.com/

IF the clearance is pretty close to tolerance, get a pre-1980 penny and rub it across the crankshaft surface. If copper is left on the journal, you "may" be able to use Crocus Cloth to polish down the rough edges.
You CANNOT use your thumbnail to determine journal smoothness.

I HAVE used old bearings, and PREFER a properly clearanced bearing fit with used bearings to one with new bearings.
The military term is "Established Wear Pattern"

If the old bearings DO have proper clearance between the journal and bearing AND proper side clearance, you cannot improve upon this with new parts.

A side note on torque, I prefer a beam type or a dial type torque wrench to a click wrench.
A Dial Type you set to the desired torque and pull to Zero.
It and the Beam Type do not lose accuracy.

Click type torque wrenches cannot be trusted for long periods unless they have been sent back for calibration.

Also, "Click Type" torque wrenches if left set up to a high torque will weaken the spring, some high end units manual will say to restore to Zero and let the tool "cool off for 24 hrs" before using again.

All Click type torque wrenches have mandatory calibration periods, regardless of usage or storage..

DrVette
33 yr toolkeeper
Old 01-04-2011, 06:58 PM   #36
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Thanks for all the info...I am familiar with the plasti-gauge.

The reason I asked the question is because, I purchased an engine from the salvage yard and before I put it in and noticed it had a cold knock (have not started it yet or installed it for that matter) I wanted to inspect the crank/bearings that way I would not have to remove the engine again and do double work.

So, you are saying that if I do take the rod/main bearings and nothing looks obviously worn/damaged and I check the clearances with plasti-gauge I can re-torque the rod/main bearing caps back down (giving all is with in spec) and all will be ok???

As for torque wrenches I only use my dial type....I have a clicker that I use for lug nuts. And I have heard and do practice unloading the clicker type torque wrench....I was thought that from the beginning.

Again thanks for the info.
Old 01-05-2011, 12:08 AM   #37
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

You said you noticed it "had a cold knock"
I must assume you started it in the old vehicle ?

If you heard a knock with it out of the chassis and open exhaust, that was some serious knock..

Anywho, if the journal to bearing clearances are within tolerance,
You must also check the side clearances on the rod bearings, crankshaft bearings, and crankshaft total end thrust.

It would be wise to spin it over and check the compression also..

You seem to know enough about all this to know the "difference" between cylinders is what's really important, like you can get by with pretty low compression provided you don't have differences of 25# or so.
I forget the "rule of thumb" on this, I'm sure someone will jump in here on this.

My 94 4.3 with 150+k miles showed from 145 to 155 or something like that.

Another point of interest is the timing chain, I "THINK" these 88 and up style engines have a real double row timing chain running against a steel gear on the cam..
If there is ANY chance of a plastic gear on the cam, replace it now while it's easy..
Again I think the plastic gears went out with AMC

While I was messing around, I suggest a Melling Oil Pump just to enhance flow a bit.
On a stock pump you can check the clearance between the gears to determine service wear and even use a tighter spring for more pressure.
BUT, more pressure is not really needed, I suggest more flow..[Melling]

My old "How to Hot Rod a Small Block Chevy" said regarding oil pressure that 10 psi per 100 hp was plenty
[since the post 1967 large journal small block chevrolet engines]

Also, as many other guys said, use SOMETHING to spin the oil pump prior to firing up a new build to make sure you lube all the really critical parts[read crank & bearings]

You can just compare the end of the dist where it fits the oil pump and slot a piece of steel rod, spin it with a drill to prime up the engine..

Waaaay back in the old days[1960's] I've built engines from VW's to Datsuns using Vaseline on the bearings and motor oil on the pistons/cyl walls,, without priming the system, but Chevy seems intent upon leaving the front rod journals a little on the dry side when oiling..

I hope this is not too much drivel
DrVette
Old 01-05-2011, 12:14 AM   #38
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

he said "before I put it in AND noticed a rod knock", which I take to mean he didnt want to install it, hear a knock and have to pull it again.....

Thanks for all your info DrVette, sounds like you know your $hite...... :-)

No plastic gears on these engines AFAIK, the 2.5l on this site does tho...... (fiber cam gear)
Old 01-05-2011, 12:48 AM   #39
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

If you heard a loud popping sound, that was my head coming out of my rear..

I dunno what I'm thinking, a busted piston has a definate knock of it's own, the sound is different from a rod or crank, but still a heavy knock..

We should not overlook a collapsed lifter, this knock is half-speed of a rod knock and may pump up AFTER you do 9 million miles of unneded work.

Your timing chain choice, IMHO ANY good double row unit should do fine.
Summit, Jegs, err those dudes in Calif, dangit I can't rememeber the name but they sell a ton of assembled long and short block engines of all makes, grr

Myself, I have here a Milodon Gear Set which I bought for my small block 427 project which is now shelved due to fuel costs.

Another suggestion, adhesives:
#1 permatex = Water Pump, Thermostat Housing, Carb base plates
it's suggested in my GM Service manual. It has NO adhesive ability, but does seal well when holding back coolant.

RTV, I like Gold O2 Safe RTV for the ends of older intakes, timing chain cover and the like.
On the ends of Intake Manifolds, use double the amount suggested per GM manual, inspect with mirror to make sure of full contact.
Using double amount[3-4mm bead] will cause the RTV to bulge out just a little bit on both sides of the intake. This will give you a O-Ring effect which may stay in place during a backfire.
disclaimer for above;
The fit between V-x engines varies greatly, some intakes have a tiny gap between them and the block and others
[like my 90 vette] have a Huge gap.


Old School stuff ->>For Cork Gaskets only,
Yellow Weatherstrip adhesive or Gorilla Snot.
For Oil Pans or Valve Covers.
Clean metal surface, bang out dents, use minimal amount on metal surface, install Cork Gasket, place pan or valve cover on flat surface with a weight on top. let cure for 12-24 hrs.
Use heavy grease on other side of cork, wipe down to a thin layer with finger, torque in place.

I never use "adhesive" on both sides of a gasket, this may present a problem upon future removal.

Permatex #1 is a sealer, not an adhesive, use on coolant seals only.
Permatex #2 is not much of either, it really only holds the gasket in place till you get it clamped down.

Head Gaskets, whew! time for a fight.
I like spray CopperCoat, I spray both sides twice, let set up for 4+ hrs and use ONLY on Cast Iron to Cast Iron heads.
Aluminum heads on cast blocks require alternative methods.

Head Bolts, use Permatex 242 Blue on the ones suggested by the book to keep oil out of the water, I forget which few bolts they are but it won't hurt to put it on all of them.
Permatex 242 Blue, 271 RED and the othe "retention" grades are "Anerobic" sealers, this means they will only set up in the Absense of oxygen,, you can put it on the bolts, set them on the shelf for a month and still it will work properly, no need to use primer when working with mild steel like engine stuff.

Spend the extra money you have on Brand Name Gaskets and Thermostats, like Stant or Robert Shaw. Many aftermarket thermostats are in generic boxes but inspection reveals made in Tenn by Robert Shaw.

Get to know your parts man at the dealership, a $5 sack of Apples or a box of Dunkin Doghnuts is a good way to get "Jobber" price on your parts. Even if you only need him every year of so, take some by at Christmas time or whenever.. [Bribery, I Know]

I use original GM parts whenever I can afford it, my dealer will tell me which place to get decent stuff when he's too high. [O'Reiley's] Parts from Autozone and Advance seem to have a really high failure rate, especially with ignition wires, rotors, caps, coils, AC compressors and other high end items.

FYI, I never use "New" ignition wires, I drop by salvage yards and pick up handfulls.. GM Service manual says "12-15,000 ohms per ft with a max of 35,000 ohms.
Why pay big bucks for junk when factory wires are really good.

One more item here, unrelated though, of the 200+ guys I've worked around, I get lots of feedback..
Shock Absorbers, factory GM shocks on Full Size Trucks, Yukons and the like seem to never wear out.
Replace them with a Gabriel or Monroe and see if it don't go south in a year or two... Never replace what ain't broke or is fixin to bust
DrVette
Old 01-05-2011, 01:46 AM   #40
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

^^^What was that!!??

Alot of info there...Thanks.

Like lesterl said, I would hate to put this engine in and notice that it has a problem that could have been resolved before I put it in...I hate doing double work when it could have been prevented. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure

Performed a halfa$$ compression test tonight....starter is bad. All I could muster on it was around 175psi +or- 2psi. I could only get about one good revolution out of it before the starter would just spin.

So, next on the list will be to get some gaskets and replace those....On the timing sets I posted neither of them will work...I was looking at summit and it said..."not for use with factory roller"....looked and looked and all I could find were single roller timing sets....due to the balance shaft on these engines...guess I am kinda limited on that end. So here is an alternative.
Old 01-05-2011, 02:17 AM   #41
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Yup, I agree, pulling a engine is a double barrell pain..

175# is "about new" in my opinion, however I don't have the spec sheet..

All my drivel boiled down, check the hardware closely,
I'd guess a bad insert on the #2 rod,
next is a collapsed lifter.. I'm hoping for the latter for ya.

If you can wade through all the muck I've posted, all of it is pertinant to something somewhere

Hopefully some of it you will find useful.

DrVette
Old 01-05-2011, 02:22 AM   #42
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Oh, I find it all useful...but, I do not have a problem with a knock right now. I am wanting to inspect the engine before I put it in my truck. See, I purchased it from a local salvage yard and I just want to make sure it will not need to come back out...at least for a year or more.

I posted about having a knock....just for reference....that would be a worst case scenario then I would have to pull it out to replace something that could have been repaired/replaced before I ever put it in. Just trying to CMA...cover my a$$.

And the title of the tread is that, if I were to remove the rod/main caps to just inspect the bearings and check clearances could I still use those bearings if everything check out ok??? Or should I get new ones instead?? Some say new, some say just put it in....I will know more when I change the oil pan gasket and have a look at her under belly.
Old 01-05-2011, 02:39 AM   #43
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Ok, glad to hear it don't presently have one..

I DO suffer from dyslexia, ADD and mild retardation in the areas of math.

I do however have a higher than average memory for specifications on various items that I use or dispense to customers..

My ability to decypher some posts has me overlooking important details that in the end makes me look like a fool, like answering a question that has already been beaten to the point of moot.

Everyone has differing high and low abilities, I seem to lean to the point of overstating, I only do this hoping to not leave out any point of value which might comprimise the job..

I have over 4 decades of actual experience with differing types of internal combustion engines, electrical generation, fasteners, pipe and fittings, adhesives, sealants, load lifting, and rules and regulations from the PSC, DOT, Fed,Ga State including massive Southern Company inhouse procedure and accounting rules.. This has resulted in a massive overlap of guidelines and infomation overload.

In hopes of not missing something important, which in my job could cost a life, or less importantly a $100 million dollar fine, I tend to overkill each attempt to assist..

My apologies, but don't get me wrong, you can't hurt my feelings, those were removed many years ago when they did my frontal lobotomy

DrVette
Old 01-05-2011, 08:06 PM   #44
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Dude, you are gonna have to quit that, ROTFLMAO.....
Old 01-31-2011, 12:25 PM   #45
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Ok, quick question.

I know I was not supposed to use a Rol-Lock disc, but that is all I had access too....so, I am changing the lower intake mani gaskets....put paper towels down the intake ports and covered the lower valley, with a shirt. Used a scraper to clean as much of the old gasket off, sprayed with gasket remover and let sit...cleaned a little more off and could not get some of the old stuff off, so I pulled out the ol' Rol-Lock disc and chucked up to my drill....and cleaned off the rest...Now, I have been reading that I should have used the little Green disc with the plastic fingers. Now, I have also read to where some people use the Rol-Lock disc with not problems and some say it (silicate) can damage the engine bearings in about 50 miles I sprayed WD-40 on the cam, lifters and push rods then I dumped a quart of oil over all of it as well before reassembly.

Did I screw up or will an oil system flush before driving be good?? I still have to pull the oil pan and replace the pan gasket, front and rear mains and timing cover before I put it in the Blazer.
Old 02-01-2011, 11:47 PM   #46
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Didnt you start another thread with that question? Guess you at least got your answer there..... :-)
Old 02-02-2011, 04:00 AM   #47
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Yea, sorry.
Old 02-02-2011, 03:57 PM   #48
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Re: Reuse Bearings??

Pardon me but i saw drvette said....427 small block...is that one of the newer fuel injected vette motors....or did you build that..?

and my answer without reading 46 posts would be to not REUSE bearings...lol
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