my new "Wait4me performance" PCM...

[AmDD]

what all info do you need to send him? that website doesnt explain things very well. :/

[disphit]

READ THE THREAD, or mail him. Man.

[AmDD]

Quote: Originally Posted by disphit

READ THE THREAD, or mail him. Man.

i have read it and unless you can find me specifically what info to send him, stfu. i figured emailing him and asking what he needs is a waste when i have 30 people right here who have asked the same thing and can answer my question. this way i can email him the info the first time, seems much more efficient that way.

[Family Man]

Quote: Originally Posted by AmDD

.......does this work the same with a 5 speed? it seems like everyone who posted has had an auto. i would assume it would work with a manual but i want to make sure before i spend the cash.

AmDD,

Yes it will work fine with a 5-speed, but my educated guess is the gains won't be as substantial as posted here with the autos. The biggest gain for me was the reduction of Torque Management, a function of the auto transmission software that greatly reduced engine timing to lower torque when the transmission shifted.

Don't get me wrong, there will be some gains, especially if you tune for premium fuel. But a V6 5-speed is already fairly potent, whereas my V6 Auto was a complete pig before the tune (fell flat on its face every time the transmission shifted).

With regard to info and communication with W4M, I'd suggest just calling them and try to talk directly with Jesse or Hannah. They were both quite helpful when I dealt with them. Just got to try and catch them when they're not too busy to answer the phone.

Good luck,

James

[Bruizer]

Quote: Originally Posted by AmDD

i have read it and unless you can find me specifically what info to send him, stfu. i figured emailing him and asking what he needs is a waste when i have 30 people right here who have asked the same thing and can answer my question. this way i can email him the info the first time, seems much more efficient that way.

Well then, you can use the search button and find your question that has already been asked by these 30 ppl you speak of and see what other ppl told them. Now that my friend, is efficient.

Quote: Originally Posted by Family Man

AmDD,

Yes it will work fine with a 5-speed, but my educated guess is the gains won't be as substantial as posted here with the autos. The biggest gain for me was the reduction of Torque Management, a function of the auto transmission software that greatly reduced engine timing to lower torque when the transmission shifted.

Don't get me wrong, there will be some gains, especially if you tune for premium fuel. But a V6 5-speed is already fairly potent, whereas my V6 Auto was a complete pig before the tune (fell flat on its face every time the transmission shifted).

With regard to info and communication with W4M, I'd suggest just calling them and try to talk directly with Jesse or Hannah. They were both quite helpful when I dealt with them. Just got to try and catch them when they're not too busy to answer the phone.

Good luck,

James

How much did you get your TM reduced, percentage wise?

[Neeseius]

haha I read through this thread, good info. Jesse sounds like he knows his stuff. I personaly went through Mach Performance for my tune, Bill deals specifically with 4.3s. I would be interested in seeing if there was a difference between wait4me's tune and Mach's tune, but it sounds like Jesse tunes it a bit more aggressive from the leaner mixtures I've been hearing about.
It's funny, I had the same hopes you guys do when my truck was stock, a chirp with my 1-2 shifts sounded badAz, but now it doesn't just chirp it peels serious rubber shifting into second. You guys should try a cam

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/S...ent_149647.htm
Theres a link for you if you're interested in knowing what TM reduction + a cam does to your 1-2 shifts, enjoy

[Family Man]

Quote: Originally Posted by Bruizer

How much did you get your TM reduced, percentage wise?

I don't know the actual percentages; and I do mean percentage(s), plural. I believe there are different amounts under different speed/throttle conditions. I basically described to Jesse how I wanted the truck to drive and left the details to the expert.

There's definitely some TM left in, because the tires stay hooked up pretty well at full throttle through the 1-2 shift. They only break loose a touch; more when traction conditions are less then good. Not as impressive as if you eliminated TM completely and had big tire-burning 1-2 shifts, but I bet the truck accelerates a lot quicker this way; and the drivetrain should hold up longer.

This is an area where Jesse really seems to know his stuff. And again, it emphasizes the importance of talking to him about what your goals are. Mine is a daily driver; someone else might want a pure quarter-miler; yet another might want high MPG.

James

[Bruizer]

Quote: Originally Posted by Family Man

I don't know the actual percentages; and I do mean percentage(s), plural. I believe there are different amounts under different speed/throttle conditions. I basically described to Jesse how I wanted the truck to drive and left the details to the expert.

There's definitely some TM left in, because the tires stay hooked up pretty well at full throttle through the 1-2 shift. They only break loose a touch; more when traction conditions are less then good. Not as impressive as if you eliminated TM completely and had big tire-burning 1-2 shifts, but I bet the truck accelerates a lot quicker this way; and the drivetrain should hold up longer.

This is an area where Jesse really seems to know his stuff. And again, it emphasizes the importance of talking to him about what your goals are. Mine is a daily driver; someone else might want a pure quarter-miler; yet another might want high MPG.

James

Thx

[Merritt]

Quote: Originally Posted by AmDD

what all info do you need to send him? that website doesnt explain things very well. :/

This is the e-mail Hannah sent to me:
Hi James,
Here is some info on what we can do for typical mileage and horsepower gains:
87-90 octanes will get 1-2 miles per gallon better gas mileage and 15-20 more horse power.
91-93 octanes will get 2-4 miles per gallon better gas mileage and 20-25 more horse power.
This will very depending on driving habits and quality of gas used. Using 10% or higher ethanol content decrease gas mileage as it is a filler. You are never locked into 1 or 2 different octanes of gas, Jesse makes the PCM a lot smarter than stock. Any time you change the octane of gas the PCM will automatically adjust all of the parameters for that octane so you will always see the maximum benefits everytime.

Replacement PCMs for 1996 - 2005 GM vehicles are $159.00 shipped. Jesse is a around 6-10 days behind in shipping out tuned cores. You can keep your stock PCM and the W4M PCM for the $159.00.

We can also program your stock PCM if you can have the down time on the vehicle. We try to return ship the same day we receive it but if that doesn't work we will ship it out the next business day. The price is $75 plus $9.00 for return shipping. We ship 2-3 day priority mail ($9.00) via the post office unless other arrangements are made.

We have free updates for the life that you own the vehicle, we ask for $9.00 for return shipping and a list of what you want change and a phone number and return address.

We accept paypal to hannahbubb@yahoo.com or checks or money orders to:
Jesse Bubb
W4M Performance
23 EMS C22 Lane
Warsaw IN 46582

We do need the following info in with your payment so Jesse can customize the the tune for what you want:
1. VIN Number
2. Any Mods
3. Tire Size
4. Rear End Gear Ratios (if changed from stock)
5. What you would like to see out of the tune.
6. Phone number and return address

Please let me know if you have any more questions!
Thank you!
Hannah

[Neeseius]

If you do not have a shift kit then there is no point in removing all of the TM. I have only 75% removed and traction is still an issue. Unless you have a shift kit then you need to keep about 25%-20% so it doesn't beat up on your tranny.

I don't know if anyone else does this, but I actualy have 100% TM, because before my truck shifts into 2nd, I let out on the throttle completely, let the trans shift, then get back into to keep accelerating. Obviously this is only when just cruising around town, but I've trained my foot to do this when driving to go easier on the tranny. I started doing this because I noticed that even under part throttle when shifting around 3000RPM my engine is starting to make quite a bit of power so when it shifted it felt like a thump, and does not feel good for the tranny.

[travy]

I'm pretty much sold on this. Just waiting to see how Merritj's turns out, then i'm completely sold.

Just need to get my few mods added in.

[Landrew]

I just sent my PCM on Tuesday. Should get it back in about 2 weeks as I am in Canada. More power and more mileage for around $135CDN total w/Shipping. Once it pays for itself (mileage increase) then it gets even better from there.

[Merritt]

This is what I requested for mine:

Remove TM by 75%
93 octane tune
Eliminate top speed limiiter

I told them I wanted more hp and better fuel economy, and to add any other mods that Jesse saw fit. Hopefully I'll hear from them soon, as soon as I do I'll update.

[Merritt]

What do you guys think, will removing the torque management by 75% create any problems in the future?

[tt85_GM]

Quote: Originally Posted by Landrew

I just sent my PCM on Tuesday. Should get it back in about 2 weeks as I am in Canada. More power and more mileage for around $135CDN total w/Shipping. Once it pays for itself (mileage increase) then it gets even better from there.

Where are you located? I've been thinking about sending them a PCM but havent really heard of people from Canada sending them, who are they shipping with? Let me know, Thanks.

[Neeseius]

Quote: Originally Posted by Merritj2417

What do you guys think, will removing the torque management by 75% create any problems in the future?

At the least it will decrease the life of your transmission. If you run it at wot a lot it may significantly decrease the life, it would be in your best interest to invest in a shift kit to help.

[Landrew]

I just sent it by Canada Post from Alberta. Cost me $32 for 5 day shipping to the US with $100 insurance. Jessie said just over $20US to ship back here (5-7days) plus the $75 tune.

I have been riding my mountain bike since for work (I need to get in shape for motocross season anyways). I was going to get the whole PCM from him but this way I save about $60 and dont have to get a Crank Relearn done. Plus I am adding sound proofing to the floor and sides (roofing rolls - the cheap homestyle way of doing it) and I also use a bit of rocker guard spray in the corners and the drivers footwell area (stop rust) and that gives off some strong stinks for about 2 weeks so that works out nice.

[Merritt]

Ok guys, my PCM came in saturday and after a quick 5 minute install, I can easily say that this is the best 160 bucks I've ever spent on my truck. The truck runs 100% better, more power, faster acceleration, etc. There's a hill near my house that I couldn't keep speed in overdrive, and after the tuned computer it handled that hill like a piece of cake, never shifted into passing gear. The shift points are perfect, the shifts are firm, but not "hard", the speedometer reads correctly, overall I'm impressed. I still haven't checked to see if the top speed limiter was eliminated, and I'll have to wait until the next time I fill up to check the gas mileage, but I'll let you guys know once I check all that stuff out. I still haven't got the crank relearn code, but once it shows up I'll get it relearned and hopefully I won't have any problems out of this computer. It only took 12 days for the computer to arrive after sending my check out, and once it arrived, I just unplugged the stock one, and replaced it with the tuned one, it fired right up.

Cliff notes: Waitforme PCM arrived, I installed it, and on a scale of 1-10 I'll give it an 11. Second cheapest mod I've done to my truck, and it yielded the most results of any mod.

[travy]

Okay. This paycheck(tuesday or wednesday) for me I'm ordering mine.

[Merritt]

Quote: Originally Posted by travy

Okay. This paycheck(tuesday or wednesday) for me I'm ordering mine.

You'll be happy!

[BLACKBOWTIESS10]

love it fellas, thinking about doing this after my new y pipe and no pre-cat mods. I do have a quick question for those who seem to understand the TQ and transmission relationship.

I have a vette servo and 1-2 accumulator spring. The servo helped 1-2 & 2-3 shifts. The spring helped also, but only for 1-2. I'd love to take the "fat" out of all the shifts, without killing parts. Mainly, I hate the way it shifted, with my mods it's nicer, but I know TQ is killing me. I want it gone, but what would that feel like with the tranny mods I have?

thanks

[hivoltagedriver]

Quote: Originally Posted by BLACKBOWTIESS10

love it fellas, thinking about doing this after my new y pipe and no pre-cat mods. I do have a quick question for those who seem to understand the TQ and transmission relationship.

I have a vette servo and 1-2 accumulator spring. The servo helped 1-2 & 2-3 shifts. The spring helped also, but only for 1-2. I'd love to take the "fat" out of all the shifts, without killing parts. Mainly, I hate the way it shifted, with my mods it's nicer, but I know TQ is killing me. I want it gone, but what would that feel like with the tranny mods I have?

thanks

The torque management is not what is causing your "flat spots." And Jesse does not usually removed the torque management. The bogging after shifts is due to improper shift points, and once you get the reprogrammed PCM installed, you will notice that it doesn't happen any more. The truck will make more power all around, and the shifts will not drop the RPMs into a range where the motor is not making the torque that it needs to be to pull right. I had the same problem with mine before the tune. I have a shft kit installed, and it would hit 2nd and fall on it's face.

[travy]

I'm calling them or e-mailing tonight to get mine set up.

[Family Man]

Quote: Originally Posted by hivoltagedriver

The torque management is not what is causing your "flat spots." And Jesse does not usually removed the torque management. The bogging after shifts is due to improper shift points, and once you get the reprogrammed PCM installed, you will notice that it doesn't happen any more. The truck will make more power all around, and the shifts will not drop the RPMs into a range where the motor is not making the torque that it needs to be to pull right. I had the same problem with mine before the tune. I have a shft kit installed, and it would hit 2nd and fall on it's face.

hivoltagedriver,

I respectfully disagree. The TM (torque management) IS what kills the torque between shifts and causes the truck to fall flat on its face. GM designed it that way to save on warranty repair costs. Jesse does not remove ALL of the TM, but he does dial back much of it (it is a variable/adjustable input, not an on or off thing). He leaves just enough to optimize traction under full-throttle shifts. TM was the primary reason I chose to go with a reprogrammed PCM.

Jesse does usually rework shift points a bit, depending on your preferences, but the difference is small relative to the TM changes, and isn't the cause of the phenomenon you're talking about. Unless you change out the stock cam, the torque curve of the 4.3 is pretty strong and broad at low rpm, and the factory shift points are still well within a good power band (provided TM isn't sucking the life out of things).

In fact, if I do have any criticism of my W4M PCM (and it's minor), it is that Jesse set the WOT (wide-open-throttle) shift points in the 5400-5500 RPM range, and my stock 4.3 just dies after 5000 RPM. I've gotten in the habit of very slightly letting the throttle off the floor just as it reaches 5000 RPM, inducing a shift. Acceleration is actually better than letting it run WOT all the way to 5400+.

I plan to change wheel/tire size at some point in the near future, and when I send the PCM back to Jesse for the free retune to the new wheel diameter, I'll have him dial back the WOT shift points a bit. Or maybe I'll bite the bullet and do a cam, pushing the power curve up the RPM band a bit.

Quote: Originally Posted by BLACKBOWTIESS10

I have a vette servo and 1-2 accumulator spring. The servo helped 1-2 & 2-3 shifts. The spring helped also, but only for 1-2. I'd love to take the "fat" out of all the shifts, without killing parts. Mainly, I hate the way it shifted, with my mods it's nicer, but I know TQ is killing me. I want it gone, but what would that feel like with the tranny mods I have?

BLACKBOWTIESS10,

I think you'll be pleased. I have the vette servo and told Jesse I wanted firm, brisk shifts, but I didn't want to tear things up or give passengers whiplash. As he tuned mine, the 1-2 shift is barely noticeable under mild throttle, but it "kicks" pretty good under hard throttle. Jesse has a lot of control over this with TM, shift times, and pressures; just tell him what you want.

Good luck all; hope this helps,

James

[Merritt]

Family Man, how long was it until the crank re-learn code showed up on your truck?

[Family Man]

Quote: Originally Posted by Merritj2417

Family Man, how long was it until the crank re-learn code showed up on your truck?

It showed up immediately.........however, the PCM I got from Jesse looked like a new unit, not a used one.

If your truck doesn't throw a code, it's possible the crank position variation registry in the PCM might still contain the data from the previous truck from which the PCM originally came. Having the wrong data could be worse than having no data.

It would be the same case if you changed the crank sensor. Your PCM would still have the original data and not throw a code; but the different crank sensor wouldn't have the same characteristics and a relearn would be appropriate.

I think I'd have the relearn done; even if there's no SES light or code. Like I said waaaay above, it cost me $20........pretty cheap peace of mind IMHO.

Good luck,

James

[Landrew]

Got mine back and installed. Since I did not have use of the truck for more than 20 days - Canadian shipping and putting the interior back to gether ( I had the interior gutted for my peel & seal soundproofing project) I can't give an honest back to back comparison opinion, I can say that it does seem quicker though. Over the next few weeks we will see how mileage goes.

[Neeseius]

I still have the same PCM as original, but I have a different engine now, the PCM was calibrated by mach performance for the new engine. I have no "crank relearn" code by should I get it calibrated?

[Merritt]

Quote: Originally Posted by Neeseius

I still have the same PCM as original, but I have a different engine now, the PCM was calibrated by mach performance for the new engine. I have no "crank relearn" code by should I get it calibrated?

I don't think you have to worry about it unless you have a new PCM installed, since you got your original one tuned it still has the correct data for your truck.

[Onimun]

How exactly do you perform the Crank relearn process? Sounds complex. Definatly looking to get one of these.

[Family Man]

Quote: Originally Posted by Neeseius

I still have the same PCM as original, but I have a different engine now, the PCM was calibrated by mach performance for the new engine. I have no "crank relearn" code by should I get it calibrated?

Quote: Originally Posted by Merritj2417

I don't think you have to worry about it unless you have a new PCM installed, since you got your original one tuned it still has the correct data for your truck.

Actually the data is specific to the crank and crank sensor, so the relearn should have been done with the PCM calibration for the new engine. Worth verifying with mach performance. No code could just mean the old engines data is still in the PCM, and getting the relearn done may give you a safer, smoother, stronger running engine.

Quote: Originally Posted by Onimun

How exactly do you perform the Crank relearn process? Sounds complex. Definatly looking to get one of these.

Please read my posts up in the middle of this thread.....all is explained.

James

[King_Ice_Flash2]

Mine got a check engine light (Random multiple misfire) when I went above 75MPH until I had the CK relearn done.

If you sent yours to him to have it calibrated, he can copy the variance curve to the new PCM/tune. Otherwise you will need to have it done.

RTFM Below
PCM Replacement (2003)
http://www.mediafire.com/?1931xzmttgi
CKP System variation learn procedure (Crank shaft position sensor)
http://www.mediafire.com/?nelwtn1gd2m

[travy]

Did you do the Crank relearn your self?

I don't have a scan tool. Think the dealership is going to take my left arm and right leg to get it done on my truck?

[King_Ice_Flash2]

Most places have a 3/4 hr minimum service charge. This procedure will take less than 10 minutes to perform. I would ask how much they charge to perform this procedure, and if they give you some ridiculous price, Just tell them, hey, this takes about 10 minutes to do (If you bring the car in already warmed up) I will give you $30, to have it done. If they say they can't do it, then just go somewhere else.

You need a bi-directional scanner, something like the POS autozone hand held won't work. I think the newer SnapOn Scanners or the GM Tech II will do it, but I used EFI-Live.

[travy]

Okay. Well once I get mine in i'll run by the dealership and see what they say.

[King_Ice_Flash2]

make sure they do the relearn ONLY. Not to re-flash the PCM.

[hkellogg]

I'm sold I'm ordering mine on monday, I already have a 2.5" catback dynomax exhaust, ported throttle body, and CAI and looking for more ways to improve power and such was gonna do a v8 swap but I heard the power isn't really that great and the cost of a turbo or blower really isn't feasible right now

[King_Ice_Flash2]

The first thing I would argue with is "the power isn't really that great." The LS1 is a great motor. You will see the same fuel mileage as the 4.3L, and there are a whole lot more performance parts available for GM V8 engines. Here's some proof. Those are drag radial tires. Your 262 probably can't even spin them. (THANK YOU BLACKX FOR THE VIDEO)!!!!!!!!!!!!!
http://www.blackx.enormouslysideways...%20quality.wmv

You are not going to gain any power by porting the throttle body. You might gain 15 HP at the most doing exhaust work.

A turbocharger will probably be out of the question because all of the parts will need to be custom made; however a new supercharger kits can be purchased for around $2500

[xtreme03blzr]

you actually would get better gas mileage with an LS1 imo..

[hkellogg]

Quote: Originally Posted by King_Ice_Flash2

The first thing I would argue with is "the power isn't really that great." The LS1 is a great motor. You will see the same fuel mileage as the 4.3L, and there are a whole lot more performance parts available for GM V8 engines. Here's some proof. Those are drag radial tires. Your 262 probably can't even spin them. (THANK YOU BLACKX FOR THE VIDEO)!!!!!!!!!!!!!
http://www.blackx.enormouslysideways...%20quality.wmv

You are not going to gain any power by porting the throttle body. You might gain 15 HP at the most doing exhaust work.

A turbocharger will probably be out of the question because all of the parts will need to be custom made; however a new supercharger kits can be purchased for around $2500

an LS1 swap is not feasible at the time, this is my daily driver I don't have the time effort or tools required to do a full on engine swap nor the money to pay for one..eventually I might get a supercharger kit but I haven't seen any kits I like that bolt on that aren't centrifugal...so a nice tuned pcm would be nice...for the moment...an LS1 swap would be super sweet but like I said I don't have the time effort or the money required

[s10blazerman4x4]

I got a question some of you that had codes removed may be able to explain for me. I read through here that some of you blocked off the egr and then the light would kick on but that you had the tune done so that the light would not be on. Can this procedure apply to other trouble codes? For instance, a P0442 code? Could that be removed during the tune? Thanks..

[King_Ice_Flash2]

Aah, so it is not because the power, it is installation cost.

Anyways Blazerman... Yes, they could remove the test for the code from the PCM, but I am not sure what effect that would have on the emissions readiness tests. Why is the light on?

[Yogi]

Lots of good info in this thread. Many thanks to the guys like CrewCabSonoma And Family Man who posted their results and gave the good feedback!

[hkellogg]

Quote: Originally Posted by King_Ice_Flash2

Aah, so it is not because the power, it is installation cost.

Anyways Blazerman... Yes, they could remove the test for the code from the PCM, but I am not sure what effect that would have on the emissions readiness tests. Why is the light on?

well truthfully I never thought much of an LS1 swap I always looked at the vortec 5.3L v8 for a swap

[Neeseius]

LS1 with 5.3 heads, you get the best of both worlds

[s10blazerman4x4]

Quote: Originally Posted by King_Ice_Flash2

Aah, so it is not because the power, it is installation cost.

Anyways Blazerman... Yes, they could remove the test for the code from the PCM, but I am not sure what effect that would have on the emissions readiness tests. Why is the light on?

Yeh that dang thing WILL NOT GO OUT. Bought truck end of January, 3 days later kicks the light and since it was at mechanics he read it, told me don't worry. Replaced gas cap after reading through here about it and it kicked it end of February. Had Autozone take it off and it just came back on last week. Thought I had it solved since I had a fuel leak at the filler hose repaired but no. Friday the light was removed and Saturday it came back on. I have been looking for the canister but I wasn't sure if I was looking at rite spot. Is it directly behind the drivers side rear tire and have a few lines going to it and a sticker that reads FUEL on it? I also can't find the purge solenoid on the motor since I read that usually will fail causing constant light on. Nor could I find the other one above the rear axle, Haha can you sense Im having difficulty fixing this? Replaced the vacuum line from fender to T (PITA) and one behind the splash shield. Anywho lol if anyone wants to throw out ideas, Ill start my own thread, dont want to hijack this. But yeh it came to me that If I get this down the road, that damn light is being solved since I have no emissions testing here.

[FraserFishin']

Question for Landrew,

I am in BC so our shipping should be fairly similar. I would do what you did and send in my PCM. How much does yours look like it will cost in total when all is done??

Is there an email for wait4meperformance? I seen they had a email for paying, a yahoo account. Is this the same one for questions?

[King_Ice_Flash2]

Quote: Originally Posted by s10blazerman4x4

Yeh that dang thing WILL NOT GO OUT. Bought truck end of January, 3 days later kicks the light and since it was at mechanics he read it, told me don't worry. Replaced gas cap after reading through here about it and it kicked it end of February. Had Autozone take it off and it just came back on last week. Thought I had it solved since I had a fuel leak at the filler hose repaired but no. Friday the light was removed and Saturday it came back on. I have been looking for the canister but I wasn't sure if I was looking at rite spot. Is it directly behind the drivers side rear tire and have a few lines going to it and a sticker that reads FUEL on it? I also can't find the purge solenoid on the motor since I read that usually will fail causing constant light on. Nor could I find the other one above the rear axle, Haha can you sense Im having difficulty fixing this? Replaced the vacuum line from fender to T (PITA) and one behind the splash shield. Anywho lol if anyone wants to throw out ideas, Ill start my own thread, dont want to hijack this. But yeh it came to me that If I get this down the road, that damn light is being solved since I have no emissions testing here.

Charcoal canister is way back by the left rear tire. Take it to a different shop who actually knows what they are doing. They use a sniffer thing/smoke to detect leaks.

[Yogi]

Quote: Originally Posted by FraserFishin'

Question for Landrew,

I am in BC so our shipping should be fairly similar. I would do what you did and send in my PCM. How much does yours look like it will cost in total when all is done??

Is there an email for wait4meperformance? I seen they had a email for paying, a yahoo account. Is this the same one for questions?

It's in this thread somewhere. Something like jessebubb@yahoo.com.

[Landrew]

The total cost with shipping both ways was $130. It took about 17 days round trip. If you wait that long it saves you $60 plus the cost of a crank relearn