Distributor Help

[Renegade_Z]

Ok guys Ive got a few simple questions. First off which way does the distributor turn? Which way do I turn it to advance the timing? It should be the opposite of the way the distributor turns correct? Just so you guys know, I installed the distributor wrong when I swapped my manifold. I had my truck tuned today by Blackbear Performance and Justin told me that Im 72* retarded. He said that should be about 2 teeth off. Does that sound about right? Thanks guys.

[Crew Cab Sonoma]

dist. rotates clockwise. go counter-clockwise to advance.
2 teeth off sounds about right for 72 deg. at the crank.

just align the balancer to timing cover marks,
pull the dist. cap, and determine if its cyl. #1 or 4
thats firing. if its closer to #4, simply rotate the crank
another full turn, align the marks again.
in the dist. base, there is a "pointer" with a "6" on it.
this marks the #1 cyl. terminal.
that should be where your rotor aligns to, when the dist.
is fully seated, and timed correctly.

[Renegade_Z]

Thats the thing, we did that. And it says that it is 2 teeth off. I dont understand why it still says its 2 teeth off and I line up that mark.

[Crew Cab Sonoma]

that is odd. there is a chance that the outer ring of the
harmonic balancer has slipped, giving you a false
TDC reading?

if its an aftermarket balancer, does the timing mark
match up with the original?

[Crew Cab Sonoma]

also, my stock balancer has 2 timing marks
on it,, yours probably does too.
you sure youre using the right one?

once i figured which mark was the true #1 TDC,
i marked mine with white paint with a small artist brush.

[Renegade_Z]

Its a stock balancer. But maybe youre right about the 2 marks, I'll try that. When I pulled my manifold I never put it on TDC, I just reinstalled the dizzy the way I thought I had removed it. When it didnt run right and started to throw the codes we put it on what we thought was TDC and reinstalled the dizzy. Now cant I just advance it 2 teeth from where it is? Or is that asking for more trouble? Thanks Crew Cab.

[Crew Cab Sonoma]

yeah, you could give that a try. might work.

[Renegade_Z]

Im gonna try on Saturday.

[Avgas]

I've been having the same problem on my 2000, the distributor seems to be afew teeth off from the mark I made, but will only go in 180* apart. I cannot adjust it teeth by teeth due to that notch that will only let it go in in 2 positions 180 * apart

[King_Ice_Flash2]

yeah, you have to remove the distributor, turn the inner shaft. To advance timing, you turn the inner shaft (cap) clockwise, not counterclockwise.

Also, when you do the TDC install, make sure you point it to the mark on the distributor and not the #1 spark plug. There should be a little triangle on it.

[12sws27]

The slot on the bottom of the dizzy is what turns the oil pump. You might have to use a long flat head screw driver to turn the slot in the oil pump to match the dizzy in order for it to drop in right.

[King_Ice_Flash2]

I usually just turn the crank until it falls in.

[Renegade_Z]

Wait a minute. I thought you turn it in the opposite direction to advance?

[King_Ice_Flash2]

you turn the distributor housing the opposite way, but since you can't do that on the 4.3L because of the clamp, you turn the shaft.

[Renegade_Z]

I think I got it. It runs better anyway. When I pulled the cap it was pointing at about 4 o'clock and when I reinstalled it it was at about 6 o'clock. Does that sound about right?

[King_Ice_Flash2]

Is the CEL gone?

[Renegade_Z]

So far nothing has come up since I cleared it.

[Renegade_Z]

I guess I jinxed myself. The code came back up this morning. As soon as I started the truck. It didnt throw it at all yesterday after I played with the dizzy, but it comes on now. Guess I advanced it too far.

[Crew Cab Sonoma]

try to scan it again, to find out how many degrees
its off, or just find TDC, and do it by the book...

if its off by just a few degrees, then its likely
the Comp cam. lots of people seem to have this problem
with the Comp cams...

[Renegade_Z]

All I have here is one of those cheap scanners. Im gonna call up my buddy and see if his shop has a scanner that can read that. Or I'll pull some strings at another local shop. Can the SOLUS or MODIS read the dizzy position?

Basically it was a little above 4 o'clock and when I turned it it ended up a little before 6 o'clock. Does that sound about right for 2 teeth?

[Renegade_Z]

And I never had trouble with the cam after I had it tuned by wait4me. And I've never had this code before I installed the marine intake.

[12sws27]

Quote: Originally Posted by Crew Cab Sonoma

... find TDC, and do it by the book...

^^^X2.

[Crew Cab Sonoma]

Quote: Originally Posted by Renegade_Z

All I have here is one of those cheap scanners. Im gonna call up my buddy and see if his shop has a scanner that can read that. Or I'll pull some strings at another local shop. Can the SOLUS or MODIS read the dizzy position?

Basically it was a little above 4 o'clock and when I turned it it ended up a little before 6 o'clock. Does that sound about right for 2 teeth?

if you moved the dist. rotor from 4 O'clock to 6 O'clock, sounds like you
retarded it more... but it shouldnt even be running at 4 teeth off...

the distributor has 13 teeth, divided by 360 degrees, which makes for
about 27.7 deg. per tooth, 2 teeth = 55.4 distributor degrees...
double the DISTRIBUTOR degrees for CRANKSHAFT degrees.
which 2 teeth would equal 110.8 degrees at the crank....

doesnt quite match up to your 72 deg. figure.
did you disassemble your distributor, and maybe put your
dist. gear back on 180 deg. off from where it was originally?

[Renegade_Z]

I thought it had 10 teeth? And no I never disassembled it. I already did it by the book with the TDC method and that didnt help. That just retarded it.

[Crew Cab Sonoma]

nope. 13. and doing by the book should have got it right,
assuming you used the correct mark on the balancer.
did you look to see if your balancer has two timing marks
cut into it?

[Renegade_Z]

Not yet. But how could it be 72 degrees retarded if there are thirteen teeth? Im gonna play with it this afternoon. I know I advanced it too much, so I'll try retarding it a little bit, see what happens.

[Crew Cab Sonoma]

thats has me puzzled as well... how is it 72 deg.
did they say if that was distributor, or crankshaft degrees???

[jhall4721]

How much timing do these engines normally run at idle? If they normally run 15 degrees advanced then add 15 to 55.4. That gets you pretty close to the 72 that was read on the scanner.

[Renegade_Z]

He said from the crank if I remeber correctly.

[Crew Cab Sonoma]

Quote: Originally Posted by jhall4721

How much timing do these engines normally run at idle? If they normally run 15 degrees advanced then add 15 to 55.4. That gets you pretty close to the 72 that was read on the scanner.

ign. advance doesnt get factored into crank/cam sensor correlation.
ideally, it should remain at zero, but i think up 4 degrees of variation
is allowed before a code gets set.

[King_Ice_Flash2]

Sounds right. I think it was 2 deg each way (+/-)

[jhall4721]

Quote: Originally Posted by Crew Cab Sonoma

ign. advance doesnt get factored into crank/cam sensor correlation.
ideally, it should remain at zero, but i think up 4 degrees of variation
is allowed before a code gets set.

Makes sense. But how would the ECM know the timing was off by 72 degrees?

[Renegade_Z]

I dont know. But it does. I played with it some but I dont have the time or the space to set the timing correctly. Im gonna take to my buddy at a shop and have him do it.

[Crew Cab Sonoma]

Quote: Originally Posted by jhall4721

Makes sense. But how would the ECM know the timing was off by 72 degrees?

basically, the PCM recieves reference pulses from the crankshaft
and camshaft (distributor) sensors, and expects them to coincide
within a certain number of degrees of each other.

if they fall outside of the accptable range, a code is set.
this basically helps to tell the factory or mechanic
that either the distributor, or the timing set wasnt
aligned correctly during assembly, rebuild, or repair,
or that the timing set is excessively worn, or has slipped.

the cam sensor is basically used on most engines equipped
with sequential fuel injection as a means of determining
which cylinder is actually firing, since the crank sensor alone
cant do this.
the addition of a cam sensor gives the PCM the ability to
know wether cyl. #1 or #4 is firing, so it can correctly
arrange and time injector sequencing...

[Crew Cab Sonoma]

any new developments on this?

[Renegade_Z]

Not yet. Im waiting for my buddy to get a new timing light. I'll wait until I get back from my trip and have him fix her up.