Cam questions

[LeSabreUltra]

I want to make my 96 S10 quicker...not necessarily a track star (I never take it to the track anyway) but a daily driver that can surprise me and others. I'd be happy with a 0-60 time of 6-7 seconds or so.

I've looked at V8 swaps, supercharging, and just lately performance camshafts. I love the idea of a V8 in my truck, but I don't think I have the ability, time, or money to do that right now. I like the supercharger too, but the cost is a little much. I'm a college student, so I'm on a limited budget. So I started looking at camshafts. With a little help, I think I could do it and it wouldn't take long to get it in and working right, and the cost is much lower than the other two options. The power gains might not be as much as forced induction or an extra two cylinders but I think I could get a healthy gain out of this.

I've been doing a TON of searching on this forum over the past several days, for each of the three options I mentioned above, so please don't say I should search...because chances are I've already seen it!

Here's a little info on my truck to start out with. It's a 96 S10, extended cab, 4.3 VIN X auto, with the 3.42 gears and no posi. I have a K&N air intake, TB mod, and a little exhaust work. No cat and a Flowmaster 40 single in/dual out.

This truck is my daily driver, so I do have reliability and around town driving in mind, though I do drive it on the highway some.

From what I've read, most here go with either the 266 or the 270 ahr cams, with the 270 being most recommended if you're going to go to the trouble of a cam swap. I plan on doing a W4M tune at the same time as the cam swap, so that it will run right. Maybe a few tuning improvements through that, whatever they can give me. I would also upgrade the springs and whatever else would be needed to support the cam.

For those of you with either of these cams, what can you tell me about how the truck drives when everything else is near stock? I know that with any cam more aggressive than stock I will lose some low end. How much will I lose, and is it really significant? Does the cam make the truck more fun to drive and give a noticeable seat in the pants improvement over stock? How does it pull through the rpm ranges?

Videos are pretty hard to find, here and elsewhere. I can't seem to find many of the 270 ahr cam videos at plain idle, so if you could share one that would be great. I'd like to hear how much of a lope it has. I've seen the one in the videos thread with the red truck but it doesn't idle for long enough to give much of an idea.

Similarly, I also can't find any acceleration videos of the 270 ahr cam, showing the speedometer. If you have one you could share that would be great too.

I did find this video of what seems like a near stock Sonoma with the 266 ahr cam. Seems pretty impressive if that's all that was done to it.

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/S...075_149645.htm

Anyway, any advice or help you could give to help me decide if a cam swap would be right for me, would be great. Thanks!
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[LeSabreUltra]

Bump...anyone? Any input would be a lot of help.
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[03zq8s10]

If your truck is stock and you are pretty much gonna leave it stock the Comp 266hr is a great cam. If you plan on modding your motor later the 270ahr will be best bet. As far as a great daily driven truck and street use the 266 will meet your needs better IMO.

[LeSabreUltra]

Thanks for your reply. I think the only other thing I'd do immediately is to port and polish the intake manifold and heads since they'd be off anyway...MAYBE install headers, but I'm not sure about those. From what I've read they don't help much unless you're into serious power, which I wouldn't be.

Any idea what kind of power I would get from the 266 cam with the ported heads, manifold, and the tune to make it all work?
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[03zq8s10]

Quote: Originally Posted by LeSabreUltra

Thanks for your reply. I think the only other thing I'd do immediately is to port and polish the intake manifold and heads since they'd be off anyway...MAYBE install headers, but I'm not sure about those. From what I've read they don't help much unless you're into serious power, which I wouldn't be.

Any idea what kind of power I would get from the 266 cam with the ported heads, manifold, and the tune to make it all work?
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I know you were wanting to know what kind of lope the 266/270 had. The 266 is not really, if noticeable but the gain is still worth it over the crappy lift of the stock cam. Even my 270 doesn't lope hard and not really noticeable either but it still sounds great. As far as a gain. I couldn't tell you exact but with just the cam itself I would imagine 20-25 extra to the wheels. My truck pulls much harder up top versus before. It's even crazier with a stall and a little boost thrown in there. Keep us posted. If you want to know more on parts and etc., let me know.

[Lifted97s-10]

i am in the exact situation as you. College student on a limited budget but i wanted to be quicker. So i came to the same conclusion as you and created a few threads about it. These should help you out a ton when it comes to parts and costs and just info you need.

http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f107/p...m-swap-405818/


http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f107/c...d-list-399626/

Also i am going to advise that with the cam you should definitely look into a more free flowing exhaust. Such as 2.5" y-pipe and maybe just a simple catback set-up like mine. I have just a hi-flow cat, and 3" piping leading to a spintech prostreet(lol get rid of the flowdisaster) and than my exhaust exits right before my rear tire. Also with the cam swap your one wheel peel is gonna suck pretty bad lol. So if you dont have the funds right now its understandable but you should invest into a posi. I am doing the ford 8.8 swap into my truck. It works out really perfect for me. So just post up some more questions if you have em. Were all here to help

[Lifted97s-10]

I would also advise you to get a transgo shift kit for your tranny. My whole shift kit + a corvette servo cost about $115 bucks and was soooo worth it. You can get a corvette servo off ebay for like 15 bucks, the transgo kit for our 4L60E can be had at summit racing for like 75 bucks, than all you need is like 5-6quarts of tranny fluid(Dextron III) 15 bucks, and than a 10 dollar tranny filter. My cousin tiresmokinv8 and I did my whole kit in one day plus the servo in about 5 hours. But now i am in love with it. The shifts are soo crisp and firm and at WOT it has no prob chirpin em really good

[Lifted97s-10]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evL5t...eature=related <this is the 266 cam but also remember that everybodys is gonna sound a little different depending on their exhaust set up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R9dA0jTDGR4 <this is the 270 cam that i am putting in in like a month!!

As you can hear the 270 cam is decently louder and has quite a bit more lope

[LeSabreUltra]

Thanks a ton for the information guys. It's gonna be a little while before I can start buying stuff and even then it'll be pretty slow going as I collect the stuff I'll need as the paychecks come in. I'll be watching your thread Lifted97, I'm interested to see what your impressions are after the swap.

Right now, I'm thinking that I'll go with the 266 cam...I would LOVE for some badass lope to it like the one in the video but I don't want to sacrifice daily driveability...and with two cars to support it might be a long time before I could do another big go-fast mod again, lol!

I'll definitely look into at least the shift kit though, possibly the corvette servo as well...my trans has been babied for it's whole 67k mile life and I want to keep it that way. Especially since I'll be more likely to be stomping on the go-pedal after this mod.

I think I've decided to not install headers...just another expense that I'm not sure would help me any. P&P of the heads and intake manifold I'm not sure about yet for the same cost reason. I could try to gasket match them myself with a dremel but I really don't want to mess anything up.

Here's a preliminary parts list, just to get the ball rolling and ideas flowing.

Comp Cams 266HR Cam (duh) 56-450-8 : $265.95 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-56-450-8/

LS6 Beehive valve springs NAL-12499224: $42.75 (From Ebay)
http://rover.ebay.com/ar/1/711-53200...4&toolid=10001 http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/LS6-valve-springs-spring-12499224-Vortec-4-3-3800-V6_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2em20Q2el1116QQ hashZitem370185961974QQitemZ370185961974QQptZMotor sQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

Comp Cams valve spring retainers CCA-787-16 : $49.25 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-787-16/

Comp Cams high energy pushrods CCA-7808-12 : $25.25 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-7808-12/

ARP High Performance Series rocker arm studs ARP-100-7201 : $49.95 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ARP-100-7201/

Trans Dapt chrome valve covers TRD-9458 : $51.95 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TRD-9458/

Trans Dapt chrome valve cover bolts TRD-9812 : $12.95 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TRD-9812/

Comp Cams high energy timing set CCA-3202 : $85.95 (From Summit)http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-3202/
Transgo shift kit TRG-4L60E-HD2 $77.95 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TRG-4L60E-HD2/

Wait 4 Me Tune (I will ship in my PCM) : $75

Everything after this is just stock replacement stuff, like gaskets and fluids. I'm just posting it here to help myself out later and to figure out the total cost.

Aluminum frame intake manifold gaskets Fel Pro MS98002T : $60.79

Timing cover gasket set Fel Pro TCS46091 $21.79

Head gaskets Fel Pro Perma Torque severe duty 510SD $34.76 for 2

Head bolts Fel Pro ES74034 $21.32 (for 2 sets)

Exhaust manifold gasket Fel Pro MS95842 $10.64

Water pump gaskets to plate and block $1.45 total

Water pump AC Delco 252711 $57.99 (just replacing it cause it's original)

Minus 5% Rock Auto discount -$10.44

Coolant $25

Oil and Filter $30

Trans refill (7 qts Dex VI plus filter and gasket) $75

Total $1039.25

Plus a random ass guess for tax (only on coolant, oil, and trans fluid), shipping, etc of $210

A nice even $1250 I need to save up. Judging from the total cost I don't think I will do head work.

I kind of copied your parts list Lifted 97...lol...that's mostly cause valvetrains are a bit of a new world to me, I won't deny that I'm a little lost. I will have help doing this though, so I ought to learn a bit along the way.

You may notice that I neglected to include valve cover gaskets. I got a little confused as to what exactly I will need with those aftermarket valve covers.

If there's anything I can cut out of this build...like I said I pretty much just copied Lifted97's build list for his 270 cam...please let me know! I'd love to save a buck. As long as I have the right parts I know I can get it all in right.

Thanks again for your help, I really appreciate it.
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[03blazer]

Well, for starters... you can cut out the head gaskets, bolts, and the exhaust manifold gaskets. You don't have to remove the heads to do a cam swap.

[LeSabreUltra]

Oh yeah, thanks...I had tallied that in there originally assuming I was going to do some head porting. I may still, I don't know. Depends on if I can find a shop around here and what they will charge.

I think I can cut out a few other things too. I would edit my post but it seems I'm past the time limit or whatever, the edit button is gone.

Can I use the stock rockers with the LS6 valve springs and the Comp Cams 787 retainers?

If so, that would eliminate a few things from my list, such as the need for an aftermarket valve cover if I'm not mistaken?

Thanks for bearing with me through all this...this is all new to me!
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[tlcooper]

yes the 787 retainer and ls6 spring work great. my cam is bigger than the 280hr and has lift over .530 intake and exhaust with NO problems whatsoever. but with the 114+4 lsa, there isnt much lope, but damn does it pull 7000rpm like nuthing. I honestly can't hold 7000 rpm cause it will defintely blow my engine but the tach will bounce off it every time...

[01x.joyride]

alright...well...ive got a 270 cam going into my 4.3l for my motor swap...one day at work i called to find out whats recommended for my cam and what not and so i got some part numbers to share with ya...
personally im using dual valve springs with my cam because my machinist didn't feel comfortable with the seat pressure of the beehive springs and the recommended springs to go with my cam...so i called COMP CAMS themselves and a guy told me some part numbers that'll work with the cam i have...here ya go man...keep in mind this is a 270 cam..my cam part # is 56-420-8 which won't work with a computer that i didn't notice until after i bought so hopefully i can get my shit tuned to work with it...lol...oh and also these i believe are all just summit racing part numbers...not sure if jegs is the same way as far as part #'s are concerned...i've only bought shit from summit so far...

dual valve springs - 986-12
retainers - 740-12
locks - 611-12

beehive springs - 26915-16
retainers- 787-12
locks- 601-12

single valve springs- 983-12
retainers- 757-12
locks- 611-12

that's pretty much all i got...

if you wanna talk to COMP CAMS themselves to double check things over, i even got their number from this paper i wrote everything down on..lol..sorry ive been drinking...heres the number though
901-795-2400

hope this all helped!!

lol and also i had to have my valve pockets worked on to accept dual valve springs also, another 80 bucks added to my bill....just so ya know beforehand!

[01x.joyride]

Quote: Originally Posted by tlcooper

yes the 787 retainer and ls6 spring work great. my cam is bigger than the 280hr and has lift over .530 intake and exhaust with NO problems whatsoever. but with the 114+4 lsa, there isnt much lope, but damn does it pull 7000rpm like nuthing. I honestly can't hold 7000 rpm cause it will defintely blow my engine but the tach will bounce off it every time...

got any vids? i wanna hear this badboy??? lol

[tlcooper]

yep here ya go:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8JcCVjJV8U

[Warren262]

Quote: Originally Posted by LeSabreUltra

Thanks a ton for the information guys. It's gonna be a little while before I can start buying stuff and even then it'll be pretty slow going as I collect the stuff I'll need as the paychecks come in. I'll be watching your thread Lifted97, I'm interested to see what your impressions are after the swap.

Right now, I'm thinking that I'll go with the 266 cam...I would LOVE for some badass lope to it like the one in the video but I don't want to sacrifice daily driveability...and with two cars to support it might be a long time before I could do another big go-fast mod again, lol!

I'll definitely look into at least the shift kit though, possibly the corvette servo as well...my trans has been babied for it's whole 67k mile life and I want to keep it that way. Especially since I'll be more likely to be stomping on the go-pedal after this mod.

I think I've decided to not install headers...just another expense that I'm not sure would help me any. P&P of the heads and intake manifold I'm not sure about yet for the same cost reason. I could try to gasket match them myself with a dremel but I really don't want to mess anything up.

Here's a preliminary parts list, just to get the ball rolling and ideas flowing.

Comp Cams 266HR Cam (duh) 56-450-8 : $265.95 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-56-450-8/

LS6 Beehive valve springs NAL-12499224: $42.75 (From Ebay)
http://rover.ebay.com/ar/1/711-53200...4&toolid=10001 http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/LS6-valve-springs-spring-12499224-Vortec-4-3-3800-V6_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp3286Q2em20Q2el1116QQ hashZitem370185961974QQitemZ370185961974QQptZMotor sQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

Comp Cams valve spring retainers CCA-787-16 : $49.25 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-787-16/

Comp Cams high energy pushrods CCA-7808-12 : $25.25 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-7808-12/

ARP High Performance Series rocker arm studs ARP-100-7201 : $49.95 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ARP-100-7201/

Trans Dapt chrome valve covers TRD-9458 : $51.95 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TRD-9458/

Trans Dapt chrome valve cover bolts TRD-9812 : $12.95 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TRD-9812/

Comp Cams high energy timing set CCA-3202 : $85.95 (From Summit)http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CCA-3202/
Transgo shift kit TRG-4L60E-HD2 $77.95 (From Summit)
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/TRG-4L60E-HD2/

Wait 4 Me Tune (I will ship in my PCM) : $75

Everything after this is just stock replacement stuff, like gaskets and fluids. I'm just posting it here to help myself out later and to figure out the total cost.

Aluminum frame intake manifold gaskets Fel Pro MS98002T : $60.79

Timing cover gasket set Fel Pro TCS46091 $21.79

Head gaskets Fel Pro Perma Torque severe duty 510SD $34.76 for 2

Head bolts Fel Pro ES74034 $21.32 (for 2 sets)

Exhaust manifold gasket Fel Pro MS95842 $10.64

Water pump gaskets to plate and block $1.45 total

Water pump AC Delco 252711 $57.99 (just replacing it cause it's original)

Minus 5% Rock Auto discount -$10.44

Coolant $25

Oil and Filter $30

Trans refill (7 qts Dex VI plus filter and gasket) $75

Total $1039.25

Plus a random ass guess for tax (only on coolant, oil, and trans fluid), shipping, etc of $210

A nice even $1250 I need to save up. Judging from the total cost I don't think I will do head work.

I kind of copied your parts list Lifted 97...lol...that's mostly cause valvetrains are a bit of a new world to me, I won't deny that I'm a little lost. I will have help doing this though, so I ought to learn a bit along the way.

You may notice that I neglected to include valve cover gaskets. I got a little confused as to what exactly I will need with those aftermarket valve covers.

If there's anything I can cut out of this build...like I said I pretty much just copied Lifted97's build list for his 270 cam...please let me know! I'd love to save a buck. As long as I have the right parts I know I can get it all in right.

Thanks again for your help, I really appreciate it.
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Let us know how your build turns out. I plan on doing a similar build down the road.

[s106banger]

ive been reading about the 270 lately and how to port vortec heads. well, these are my plans from the information ive gathered.
270 cam
ls6 springs
comp 787 retainers
new lifters-you dont really need these, but mine make noise and it bothers me.
cloyes timing set
stock locks
stock rockers
stock pushrods-ive heard that you need longer pushrods, stock it 7.200". ive heard of people getting valve train noise because of it. i figured id try the stock ones, if they make noise i can easly change them out for some longer ones.
light bowl work, and port matching
stock size manley ss undercut valves
i think i could do the minimum and put just a cam in for 600 bucks. this project for me is prob only gonna cost 500 bucks, keep an eye for deals!